View source for Talk:Sapper/Archive 1

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==Bug: Indestructible sapper==
I'm not totally sure if this is why it happens, but I believe that if you build a tele at the exact moment the other end is being sapped, a sapper appears on the engie's end that may be removed but is instantly and magically replaced, even though the other end is gone.  I believe this may happen with other buildings.[[User:Cranberry Jerk|&#123;&#123;SUBST:User:Cranberry Jerk/Sig}}]] 16:14, 23 June 2011 (PDT)
:Have you considered the possibility that there's a Spy at the other end sapping it continually? --'''[[User:Cooper Kid|<span style="color:red">Coo</span><span style ="color:gray">per</span><span style ="color:blue"> Kid</span>]]''' <small>([[User_talk:Cooper Kid|Blether]]''' · '''[[Special:Contributions/Cooper Kid|Contreebs]])</small> 18:02, 23 June 2011 (PDT)
: As I mentioned, it still happens even though the other end is already gone from the sapping.  He cannot sap a lone tele from across the map. Something like that happened to a sentry of mine, even though the spy was dead (really).  A sapper kept reappearing and I could do nothing.I'm not exactly sure what the conditions are, but this can happen.  [[User:Cranberry Jerk|&#123;&#123;SUBST:User:Cranberry Jerk/Sig}}]] 18:42, 23 June 2011 (PDT)

==Can Engineers get sapper kill assists from Pyros?==
I don't think so, since it only takes one hit to destroy a sapper. [[User:Delicious cake|Delicious cake]] 21:34, 1 July 2010 (UTC)
:What about in the instance where the Engineer hits the sapper once, damaging it but not destroying it, and then a Pyro destroys it? That would be a kill assist for the Engineer.--<span style="color:purple">'''''Focusknock'''''</span>  [[Help:Group rights|<span class="burbg">s</span>]] 20:13, 9 November 2010 (UTC)

== Sapper skin ==

That skin is awesome. If I had an iphone/ipod touch, I would totally get that. --[[User:Firestorm|<font color="#FF6600"><tt><big><u>'''Firestorm'''</u></big></tt></font>]] {{mod}} 16:57, 12 August 2010 (UTC)
: Me too. All the new merchandise is cool. -- [[User:Nineaxis|<span style="color:#FF8C00;font-weight:bold">Nineaxis</span>]] {{mod}} [[File:User Nineaxis sig duck.png|12px]] 17:00, 12 August 2010 (UTC)
:: It's too bad that international shipping is twenty freakin' dollars --[[User:Firestorm|<font color="#FF6600"><tt><big><u>'''Firestorm'''</u></big></tt></font>]] {{mod}} 17:01, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

== "Destroy 3 0" exploit ==

I would argue the "Destroy 3 0" trick belongs in Bugs, since it's prone to abuse - I managed to milk a single unattended Level 1 Sentry for over 20 points before it got destroyed by the Sapper damage. And that was with a simple bind; with scripting the situation is likely a lot worse. [[User:NVis|NVis]] 22:14, 14 November 2010 (UTC)
:It likely won't get fixed until it gets more exposure. [[User:MK|MK]] 08:42, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

== Trivia ==

"Although it was sped up severely, the Spy would slowly flick a switch on the Electro Sapper's interface."
Is the term 'severely' used properly here? The definition of the word is "difficult to endure" or "grave". I don't think that that word would be properly used in this setting. 
How about "Although greatly sped up,..." or something similar? [[User:Funkadacious|Funkadacious]] 22:51, 15 November 2010 (UTC)
:"Severely" isn't completely out of context, but something like "significantly" would probably be a better word. [[User:Toomai|Toomai]] [[User talk:Toomai|Glittershine]] 23:10, 15 November 2010 (UTC)
::I agree. "severly" just sounded a bit out of place to me. [[User:Funkadacious|Funkadacious]] 23:37, 15 November 2010 (UTC)
"In an earlier version, the Spy would slowly flick a switch on the Electro Sapper's interface." Doesn't he still flick the switch when he first grabs the Sapper after he spawns or changes class?[[User:Ziom236|Ziom236]] 21:57, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

== Infobox Fix? ==

I had a discussion about this with someone else, but does anyone know why the infobox has lines for "Tradeable" and "Giftable," even though other pages with almost identical infobox data don't suffer from this? Just curious, as I sifted through the page for almost an hour the other day and couldn't think of a way to remove the lines (rather than just putting in "no" variables for Tradeable and Giftable as they are now). Anyone know of a fix? [[User:StarYoshi|StarYoshi]] 00:06, 29 November 2010 (UTC)
: Maybe it is something specific to Item Infoboxes, but altogether im not sure [[User:Scatmanjohn|<b><sup>Scatman</sup> <sub>John</sub></b>]][[File:User_Scatman.png|25px]] <small>([[User talk:Scatmanjohn|Talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Scatmanjohn|Contrib]])</small> 00:06, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

== Damage reduction ==

I noticed in update history section, at the "December 20, 2007 Patch", that this was changed: "Sapped buildings now take slightly less damage from the Spy who sapped them.". However, this is not mentioned anywhere else, and it definitely qualifies as being relevant, regardless of the size of this damage reduction. Shouldn't it be added to the page (Damage and function times) given someone knows specifically how much damage is reduced? [[User:Mikau|Mikau]] 01:25, 14 June 2011 (UTC)
: That update is so old, I'd be surprised if it still applied. Someone should test. [[User:Balladofwindfishes|Balladofwindfishes]] 01:27, 14 June 2011 (UTC)

== That gauge on the sapper's front ==

I'm pretty sure that previously the arrow on that gauge has risen when you were in sapping range of the building, when the white sapper outline appears. When was that removed and why? — [[User:Zhnigo|Zhnigo]] 00:40, 16 July 2011 (PDT)

== Sapper health ==

Do we know how much health Sappers have? It's definitely somewhere between 65 and 130, but can we find out for sure? [[User:Toomai|Toomai]] [[User talk:Toomai|Glittershine]] 20:08, 13 December 2011 (PST)
:They don't really have "health" as such, or they would be affected by crits (even with 130 health one crit from a Wrench would destroy it). The rules are simply "2 hits from a wrench or 1 from the Homewrecker and it's destroyed". '''» [[User:Cooper Kid|<span style="color:red">Coo</span><span style ="color:gray">per</span><span style ="color:blue"> Kid</span>]]''' <small>([[User_talk:Cooper Kid|blether]]) • ([[Special:Contributions/Cooper Kid|contreebs]])</small> 06:36, 14 December 2011 (PST)
::Um, it's a building, so it wouldn't be affected by crits. [[User:Toomai|Toomai]] [[User talk:Toomai|Glittershine]] 03:46, 16 December 2011 (PST)
:::So sappers are buildings now? '''» [[User:Cooper Kid|<span style="color:red">Coo</span><span style ="color:gray">per</span><span style ="color:blue"> Kid</span>]]''' <small>([[User_talk:Cooper Kid|blether]]) • ([[Special:Contributions/Cooper Kid|contreebs]])</small> 03:53, 16 December 2011 (PST)
::::They've always been buildings in the technical sense - they respond to "build" and "destroy" commands, their placement is confirmed by a white outline, they produce metal gibs when destroyed, and so on. [[User:Toomai|Toomai]] [[User talk:Toomai|Glittershine]] 04:00, 16 December 2011 (PST)
:::::That... makes sense I suppose. '''» [[User:Cooper Kid|<span style="color:red">Coo</span><span style ="color:gray">per</span><span style ="color:blue"> Kid</span>]]''' <small>([[User_talk:Cooper Kid|blether]]) • ([[Special:Contributions/Cooper Kid|contreebs]])</small> 04:54, 16 December 2011 (PST)

== Trivia - Sapper code ==

On any TF2 wiki page, you can press UP UP DOWN DOWN LEFT RIGHT LEFT RIGHT B A ENTER, and the Spy will come down and place a temporary Sapper on the TF2 logo.
I haven't seen this listed anywhere on the Wiki... anyway, should this be added to the trivia section for the Sapper (and the Spy)?
[[User:DarkQuill|DarkQuill]] 03:45, 1 March 2012 (PST)

:I do remember seeing this somewhere --<sup>[[File:BLU_Prince_Tavish%27s_Crown.png|15px]]</sup>[[User:King Of Space|<span style="font-family:futura; color:#075155 ">king of space</span>]] 04:04, 1 March 2012 (PST)
::It certainly doesn't belong on any of the class or weapon articles. I think it's in the "Did you know" section somewhere, but it's really not relevant to TF2. '''» [[User:Cooper Kid|<span style="color:red">Coo</span><span style ="color:gray">per</span><span style ="color:blue"> Kid</span>]]''' <small>([[User_talk:Cooper Kid|blether]]) • ([[Special:Contributions/Cooper Kid|contreebs]])</small> 05:31, 1 March 2012 (PST)

== Bug: seeing the white sapper outline ==

I've been noticing a certain bug: you can sometimes see the white sapper outline on a friendly building a split second before an enemy spy saps it (sometimes, just as the spy begins the animation of placing the sapper). It seems to happen only when the spy sapping the building is disguised as you (or maybe just as a member of your class) [[User:Rum N Napalm|Rum N Napalm]] 13:02, 21 March 2012 (PDT)

== Backpack Sapper ==

In the backpack it's just called "Sapper" no electro, so either the loadout box needs to be changed or the page does. - [[User:Devozade|Devozade]] 19:54, 22 March 2012 (PDT)

In relation to this, I've removed the backpack icon from 'unused content' [[User:TheUniverse|TheUniverse]] 20:16, 22 March 2012 (PDT)
:Yeah, it is definitely just "Sapper" in the English localization file. The only places with mention of "Electro Sapper" are in the game tips or on the model/art itself. —&nbsp;[[User:C2Talon|C2Talon]]&nbsp;(<i>[[Special:Contributions/C2Talon|c]]</i>/<i>[[User_talk:C2Talon|t]]</i>) 16:22, 23 March 2012 (PDT)

== Strange Ranks ==

Since the [[Spirit Of Giving]] has its list of [[strange]] ranks on its page, wouldn't it only be logical if the Sapper's ranks were displayed on this page? -[[User:scourgething|Scourgething]] 23:46, 23 March 2012 (CET)
:[[w:wp:bb|Be bold]]. Go for it. [[Help:Style_guide|Within reason]] of course. [[Help:Style_guide/Trivia|Adding trivia]] is another matter though. —&nbsp;[[User:C2Talon|C2Talon]]&nbsp;(<i>[[Special:Contributions/C2Talon|c]]</i>/<i>[[User_talk:C2Talon|t]]</i>) 16:22, 23 March 2012 (PDT)

== Building slot ==
In the game files, the listed slot of the Sapper is "building." Yes, I know the Sapper shows up when pushing the button that is normally for secondary while playing as Spy, but to say that it is in the secondary slot is misleading. I would change it in the article, but I have also noticed many other articles that have slots listed incorrectly as well. The main offenders being all the Spy revolvers. The revolvers are all listed as primary, but are actually secondary weapons. Was there a consensus reached at some point to label all these items as such, or is it just a perpetuating misunderstanding? In my opinion, it is pretty awkward to label the revolvers as primary weapons, then say that while crafting them they are considered secondary. Just saying that the revolvers are secondary weapons from the get-go would simplify things. And that is definitely the same for Sappers, especially if they are ever able to be crafted into a Building Token, or if other weapons with that use the building slot start being created than just the 2 now. —&nbsp;[[User:C2Talon|C2Talon]]&nbsp;(<i>[[Special:Contributions/C2Talon|c]]</i>/<i>[[User_talk:C2Talon|t]]</i>) 16:22, 23 March 2012 (PDT)

== Requested move ==

Requested move to Sapper.

Basis: It's the in-game item name, and we like to be consistent. Not much else to say.

Discuss. {{user:r4wrz0rz0r/sig/actual}} 14:24, 25 March 2012 (PDT)

:{{c|support}}[[User:Rebmcr|<span style="font-family:&#34;TF2 Build&#34;,sans-serif;font-size:120%"><span style="color:#FF2A55;">reb</span><span style="color:#002A55;">mcr</span></span>]] 14:27, 25 March 2012 (PDT)

:{{c|agree}} This is a pretty open and close case. This page title is just an artifact from before we started putting emphasis on proper titles that match item name strings. -- [[User:Lagg|Lagg]] [[File:Backpack_Stickybomb_Launcher.png|24px|link=User_talk:Lagg]] 14:28, 25 March 2012 (PDT)
:{{c|agree}} Can't argue with the name in the backpack. — [[User:Armisael |'''Armisael''']] <small>([[User_talk:Armisael |T]] | [[Special:Contributions/Armisael |C]])</small> 14:29, 25 March 2012 (PDT)

== engineer ==

im not sure if this is a bug but i have noticed you cannot destroy your buildings while they are in the process of being sapped. [[User:TubbyMonster|TubbyMonster]] 19:50, 20 May 2012 (PDT)
:Not a bug, read at Update History before and you will know why. [[File:Killicon_black_rose.png]] [[User:Hinaomi|Hinaomi]] 21:03, 20 May 2012 (PDT)

== Did anyone else notice.... ==

When you have your sapper out, (any of them, Red Tape Recorder, etc.), and you cloak, the spy has a third hand come out to show the watch. If you cant see this try changing your FOV in the console. I dont know whether this is a bug or what, but i know im not the only one who has seen this.
[[User:Platinum Time|Platinum Time]] 18:41, 1 October 2012 (PDT)
:This has been noticed before. However, it was not considered noteworthy enough for a bug. This effect can also be observed by reloading the revolver while pulling out the dead ringer. It is simply a conflict of animations. [[User:Darkid|<span style="color:red">Darkid</span>]] ([[Image:Item icon Prancer's Pride.png|21px|link=User_talk:Darkid|alt=talk]]|[[Image:Item icon Pyrovision Goggles.png|21px|link=Special:Contributions/Darkid|alt=contribs]]) 18:43, 1 October 2012 (PDT)

== Question regarding editing ==

I am thinking of adding a picture of the sapper in third person and spy holding it in the gallery, to show how the new c_model looks like, perhaps also update the 3d preview of it as well, is it okay? [[User:Datgmann|Datgmann]] 10:28, 17 April 2013 (PDT)
:{{c|yes}} or at least as far as I know, the notice may need to be changed or removed. do we need an updated 3-d image? [[User:Superprototype|Super Prototype... not so super.]] 11:14, 17 April 2013 (PDT)
:{{c|yes}} we do, the back of the sapper model was modified a lot, as well as the handle's position was changed. [[User:Datgmann|Datgmann]] 11:17, 17 April 2013 (PDT)
:Old 3rd person is better, because everyone can see the new one now, but old one is not. [[File:User Hinaomi Hinaomi-sig.png|link=User:Hinaomi]] [[User:Hinaomi|Rikka Takanashi]] <small>([[User talk:Hinaomi|talk]]) • ([[Special:Contributions/Hinaomi|contributions]])</small> 11:18, 17 April 2013 (PDT)
::Your statement is unclear to me, mind explaining it in terms as if I were a fool? I AM A FOOL MOST OF THE TIME SO THIS IS NOT NEW TO YOU IS IS, Hinomi? [[User:Superprototype|Super Prototype... not so super.]] 11:23, 17 April 2013 (PDT)
::I agree, isn't the wiki supposed to be up to date? I do not see the purpose of keeping this 3d view of the old model, as it is outdated. [[User:Datgmann|Datgmann]] 11:25, 17 April 2013 (PDT)
:::To both of you, I talked about uploaded image that I think we should do the old holding, because new holding is easier to see. About 3D model, I didn't say that we should keep. Sorry for not clearly statement. [[File:User Hinaomi Hinaomi-sig.png|link=User:Hinaomi]] [[User:Hinaomi|Rikka Takanashi]] <small>([[User talk:Hinaomi|talk]]) • ([[Special:Contributions/Hinaomi|contributions]])</small> 11:29, 17 April 2013 (PDT)

== Sentry Operating Manual ==
It says on the page that the Sentry Operating Manual refers to the Sapper as the '''AM/FM Sapper''', but I checked and that's not the name they use. They refer to it as the '''AM/FM Ultra-Sapper'''. I checked the manual [http://storefront.steampowered.com/Manuals/440/SentryManual_web.pdf (found here)]. This isn't a big error, but I'm going to change it. 
<small>— ''The preceding unsigned comment was added by'' '''[[User:TheNoobThatWas|TheNoobThatWas]]''' ([[User talk:TheNoobThatWas|talk]]) • ([[Special:Contributions/TheNoobThatWas|contribs]]) </small>

== Naming Trivia ==

Is it relevant that a sapper is also the name for a combat engineer? Could this be a source for the name sapper? [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sapper Wikipedia source] [[User:Crh23|Crh23]] ([[User talk:Crh23|talk]]) 14:09, 24 February 2014 (PST)
: Although the spy does do the following which is to allow passage for the team while impeding the enemy team and the sapper does do that duty... I would honestly think it does sound relevant. However some more discussion may be needed for sure. [[User:Ashes|Ashes]] ([[User talk:Ashes|talk]]) 14:12, 24 February 2014 (PST)
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