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| − | == Details ==
| + | {{Talk archive |
| − | | + | | arc1name = Archive 1 |
| − | I'm new here, which will explain my question. What is the meaning of the two headings in the icon column, "backpack" and "kill"? Perhaps a text legend should be added with links to pages that have a longer explanation would be in order.
| + | | arc1link = Talk:Weapons/Archive 1 |
| − | [[User:RobShaver|RobShaver]] 18:38, 14 July 2010 (UTC)
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| − | Should we have a "Details" or "Special" column that summarizes special attributes and non-weapon weapons (Wrangler, lunchbox items, backburner, etc.)? [[User:Strange Quirk|Strange Quirk]] 01:04, 14 July 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :Perhaps, but I don't think it'd fit horizontally on small screens D: — [[User:WindPower|<span style="font-weight:bold;">Wind</span>]] {{mod}} 01:19, 14 July 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :: The Icon column is for two things, the backpack icon, and the kill icon. There really isn't an explanation needed. As for an additional column, the details are all located on the weapon page, this page is merely for summarizing all the specific statistics of the weapon for comparison and reference. A "details" section may make it look a bit bloated. --[[User:Firestorm|<span style="color:#FF6600;text-decoration:underline;font-weight:bold;"><tt><big>Firestorm</big></tt></span>]] {{mod}} [[File:User Firestorm Nuke Sig.jpg]] 18:44, 14 July 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :: I've changed the Icon column so it's a bit more specific. Thoughts? --[[User:Firestorm|<span style="color:#FF6600;text-decoration:underline;font-weight:bold;"><tt><big>Firestorm</big></tt></span>]] {{mod}} [[File:User Firestorm Nuke Sig.jpg]] 18:55, 14 July 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :::Actually, before the move we were considering removing the weapon damage columns so that changed values only had to be kept updated on the individual weapon pages themselves, with this page acting more as a sort of hub. This would also free up some space for a details section which could describe the weapon attributes in brief. Smash is okay with it last I checked, anyone against this? --[[User:Wilsonator|Wilsonator]] 19:26, 14 July 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :::: I prefer having the damage column here. I think a details section is unnecessary, as once you know the details of a weapon, you won't forget it, but you will forget the damage often. I like being able to compare the point-blank damage of the FaN and Scattergun (for example) and notice that a crit FaN will NOT kill a Soldier in one hit, where that info would normally be buried and not noticed as easily in the individual weapon page --[[User:Firestorm|<span style="color:#FF6600;text-decoration:underline;font-weight:bold;"><tt><big>Firestorm</big></tt></span>]] {{mod}} [[File:User Firestorm Nuke Sig.jpg]] 19:32, 14 July 2010 (UTC)
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| − | == Damage Per Second? ==
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| − | Should we have a column for DPS? If people think the table would be too wide, should we include it in the weapon pages? Its useful information, especially when comparing weapons. If it were up to me, I would have a "short term DPS" which would only take into account time between shots, and "long term DPS" which would account for reload times, but that might be overkill. Still, how else are you going to easily find out which weapons can take out a building in the shortest time? [[User:Strange Quirk|Strange Quirk]] 02:54, 24 July 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :I'll add it if I don't get a response. [[User:Strange Quirk|Strange Quirk]] 12:38, 27 July 2010 (UTC)
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| − | ::I wouldn't say there's much need for a DPS column. While it's increasingly RPGish, TF2 is still an FPS and taking imperfect aim, the generally short and explosive nature of the combat, the fact you're usually fighting more than one opponent and the firing rates of all the weapons into account, getting a standardised DPS for every one would be difficult and probably not useful enough to make it worth it. When it comes to taking out buildings, it's more down to general knowledge and the strategy sections, just a short note in the minigun/flamethrower descriptions about how they're ideal for taking out SGs would do the same thing. That and it'd be hell updating it for every weapons page and on this page whenever valve patches the damage values for a weapon. --[[User:Wilsonator|Wilsonator]] 15:24, 27 July 2010 (UTC)
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| − | ::: Yeah, we've talked about this before. If the person really wants to know it, they can figure it out using base damage and attack interval. --[[User:Firestorm|<font color="#FF6600"><tt><big><u>'''Firestorm'''</u></big></tt></font>]] {{mod}} [[File:User Firestorm Nuke Sig.jpg]] 15:59, 27 July 2010 (UTC)
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| − | ::::Eh, ok. Though if you want to take into account reload times its not completely trivial. I'm not going to press it further, but i think that at least for the miniguns and flamethrowers we should have DPS instead of bullet/particle damage, since those are pretty useless. [[User:Strange Quirk|Strange Quirk]] 19:19, 27 July 2010 (UTC)
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| − | ::::: The DPS is listed on the individual weapon pages for those weapons --[[User:Firestorm|<font color="#FF6600"><tt><big><u>'''Firestorm'''</u></big></tt></font>]] {{mod}} [[File:User Firestorm Nuke Sig.jpg]] 19:29, 27 July 2010 (UTC)
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| − | == Hidden attributes ==
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| − | Since it applies to multiple weapons, I'm putting it here. If you look on TF2Items/items_game.txt, you can see that certain hidden attributes present on some weapons are down right weird...
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| − | Huntsman: Primary max ammo bonus (0.5) (37=0.5)
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| − | As far as I know, you have less arrows than bullets with the sniper rifle.
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| − | Crit-a-cola: Lunch box adds mini-crits (2)
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| − | This is right under the visible "Mini-crit" attribute, so I don't know what that means.
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| − | Also, the Flare gun has an hidden attribute which is "Secondary max ammo penalty", which makes sense since it does have less ammo than the shotgun.
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| − | We're getting trolled hard by Valve D: -- [[User:Vi3trice|<font color=#771d6d>'''Vi3trice'''</font>]] {{adm}} <sub>([[User_talk:Vi3trice|talk]])</sub> 18:37, 12 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | : the 0.5 "bonus" turns 25 sniper bullets into 12 arrows. A lot of these are hidden attributes because they are understood by the weapon's nature, or in the case of the huntsman/flare gun are significantly different from their base weapon, so it's unnecessary to state such attributes, because players can assume that they would be different. -- [[User:Nineaxis|<span style="color:#FF8C00;font-weight:bold">Nineaxis</span>]] {{mod}} [[File:User Nineaxis sig duck.png|12px]] 19:15, 12 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | ::Including adding nonsensical names to it? I mean, it says bonus. It's almost as weird as Robin hitting the server with sticks. -- [[User:Vi3trice|<font color=#771d6d>'''Vi3trice'''</font>]] {{adm}} <sub>([[User_talk:Vi3trice|talk]])</sub> 19:23, 12 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | == Drop screens ==
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| − | I had an idea, that we could add the drop/craft screen image of each weapon. Like, for [http://screenshot.xfire.com/s/98280134-4.jpg example]. Good idea? Same for hats too. [[User:CWalkthroughs|CWalkthroughs]] 22:07, 18 September 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :There's no point, the backpack icons for every weapon are already on the page. -[[User:The Neotank|<font color="#FF8C00">'''The Neotank'''</font>]] ({{mod}}<small> | [[User talk:The Neotank|Talk]]</small>) [[File:User The Neotank Signeotank.jpg]] 22:30, 18 September 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :: Ah yea, never thought of that. [[User:CWalkthroughs|CWalkthroughs]] 22:37, 18 September 2010 (UTC)
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| − | == The Frying Pan ==
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| − | The soldier's new frying pan hasn't been added to the weapons page. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xKaKyWwvct4] It is a reskin of the soldier's shovel, and was added in the Mannconomy update. --[[User:Stevoisiak|Stevoisiak]] 19:08, 3 October 2010 (UTC)
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| − | == Scout Bats ==
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| − | The Bat and Sandman are listed with damage range 24-46 here, and 32-39 in their individual pages. Which is correct? [[User:Hrusha|Hrusha]] 22:36, 7 October 2010 (UTC)
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| − | == Number of Vintage Weapons ==
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| − | I counted 35. I'm not sure if Valve is planning to implement a way for the new weapons/hats to become vintage, so if they say something suggesting they do obviously my factoid is subject to change. [[User:Geno|Geno]] 03:45, 11 October 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :This is not true. According to the TF2 Team:
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| − | :::''Some items that used to be rare will become more common when they are available for purchase. We wanted to give players this option, but still recognize people who obtained those items “the old-fashioned way” in the past. So we decided to perform a one-time conversion of all the old items into "Vintage" versions, which will never be attainable in the future. This way, those older rare items remain rare (in fact, they're even rarer, because they're limited editions now).''
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| − | :Now based on this, no more Vintage Items will be added. [[User:Danton|Danton]] 21:17, 11 October 2010 (UTC)
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| − | == True Primaries (Spy & Demoman) ==
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| − | Forget about Crafting for a moment. According to the Animation sets, the Spy does not have a Primary Weapon Animation. His Revolver is refereed to as "Secondary". This is also why the Ambassador is a Secondary Slot craftable. Primary Weapons are usually the most important/powerful weapon that class has. You may think differently but I would rather backstab a Medic then his Heavy than shoot them with a Gun with a chance of the Heavy seeing. On another note, the Spy holds his Knife in the class selection screen while the others (excluding the Medic) are wielding their Primary. Now for the Demoman, in the Animation Sets, the Stickybomb Launcher is refereed to as "Primary" and the Pipe Bomb Launcher is "Secondary". Also the Scottish Resistance and the Chargin' Targe replace the Stickybomb Launcher. On top of this, the Stickybomb Launcher can deal more damage at once than the Grenade Launcher. The most likely reason these weapons are not the first weapon in the Buckets is probably because these weapons are not practical standard weapons. They are more so Opportunity Weapons. [[User:Danton|Danton]] 21:40, 11 October 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :That's lovely. We're not changing which are primary. {{n}}[[User:Smashman|<span class="bur">Smashman</span>]]<sub> ([[User_talk:Smashman|talk]])</sub> {{bur}} 21:50, 11 October 2010 (UTC)
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| − | ::Good to know. I never expected you to. Just wanted to share what I have found. [[User:Danton|Danton]] 13:35, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :::We already knew about that. To add to the confusion, just look at the disguise system. Take out your revolver, press Last Disguise and look at which weapon your disguise has. That's also why we're not switching it. -- [[User:Vi3trice|<font color=#771d6d>'''Vi3trice'''</font>]] {{adm}} <sub>([[User_talk:Vi3trice|talk]])</sub> 13:43, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
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