Talk:Hot Hand

Requested Move: Slap Attack

Valve decided last minute to rename the weapon from "Hot Hand" to "Slap Attack." Although the Day 3 page calls it the Hot Hand, the patch notes call it the Slap Attack. http://www.teamfortress.com/jungleinferno/notes.php -- Dr. Scaphandre 14:48, 20 October 2017 (PDT)

Turns out they didn't change the name after all and it was just a typo. -- Dr. Scaphandre 15:34, 20 October 2017 (PDT)

If the BLU Hot Hand is unseen in-game, shouldn't it be unused content?

Also, I'm not sure where this BLU skin was found, because both c_slapping_glove and w_slapping_glove has the grey color for both teams (as well a third unused skin with a slightly darker yellow band). Was it eventually replaced (to use the same colors as the RED team) after the initial patch in the Jungle Inferno Update? - ▪ - 14:06, 3 February 2020 (UTC)

It seems Valve silently replaced/removed it in an unknown patch. The BLU variant never had its own texture; they merely manipulated the colors via the VMT file, but for some reason it never got applied to the viewmodel.  Wookipan (talk | contribs) 15:43, 3 February 2020 (UTC)

Most likely it was a "$color2" attribute. "$color2" is only read by the Model Viewer, in-game, "$color2" is ignored, and "$colortint_base" is used instead. Some cosmetics has values for "$color2" which are different than "$colortint_base", causing to show differently on HLMV (requiring it to fix it, which was the case for this one). - ▪ - 17:04, 3 February 2020 (UTC)

Incorrect Bug?

There's a bug listed:

• The attribute -20% damage penalty is incorrect; the actual damage penalty is -14%.

I'm not sure if this was written based off calculated values, but I looked at the items_game.txt (specifically at line 60274) and I see that the damage penalty is 20% (damage penalty "0.8").

DestroyedClone (talk) 11:29, 12 July 2020 (UTC)

• The base damage of Fire Axe is 65.
  • -20% damage penalty = 65 x (0.8) = 52
• The base damage of Hot Hand is 28 (x2) = 56
  • 65 x (A) = 56, A = 56 / 65 = 86% of the actual damage = -14% damage penalty.

I'm not sure what part of the code making this weapon damage penaly apply incorrectly, but if the base damage on this is correct, this bug is correct. Rikka Takanashi (talk) • (contributions) 13:08, 12 July 2020 (UTC)

Finger posing

It's a bug none-the-less, and the reason I documented it was because it caused a lot of trouble and confusion for me, which in my eyes makes it important. Cheezcracker (talk) 23:05, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

Not all bugs are documented, very minor bugs are not documented because the bugs section should be contained to bugs that are somewhat (or can be somewhat) relevant. Seeing as this bug only applies to the Loadout screen and makes a very small part of the Pyro slightly more bent, I don't see how this can possibly cause any kind of trouble. Please see the Bugs style guide for specific guidelines regarding Bugs.
| s | GrampaSwood (talk) (contribs) 23:20, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

It caused me a lot of trouble, it is impossible to go in third person in valve servers, the hot hand is rarely used, and the loadout screen (aswell as third party sites such as loadout.tf) do not use the correct animation, which caused me to feel confused as to what the animation actually looked like. Cheezcracker (talk) 23:40, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

I'm still not exactly sure what the trouble is here, the bug here is a very very small animation change that isn't noteworthy at all. It seems like your trouble was more with finding a way to see third person animations than it was to this bug.
| s | GrampaSwood (talk) (contribs) 00:01, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

The trouble was me being super confused what the animation actually looked like since there was so much conflicting info about it, and I could not find any pictures of Pyro with the Hot Hand equipped online. I needed to know for personal reasons. Also I could argue that, considering the hand is where the eye would be drawn, the animation change isn't that small. I see no reason not to document this. Cheezcracker (talk) 08:30, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

To reiterate what Grampa has been saying, bugs like this are never mentioned as to me they fall under the same category as clipping bugs, there are so many of them and so unnoteworthy that half the cosmetics pages would be filled up with the same "this cosmetic clips with XYZ" if we were to add them to pages. Cheddar (talk) 09:43, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

In my opinion, this isn't the same as a clipping bug, it is an example of the wrong animation playing, which caused me genuine confusion, which in my opinion, proves this needs to be documented. I tried finding anyone else who noticed this and I was unable to find this bug documented anywhere, which caused me to go on a wild goose chase trying to figure this out. Cheezcracker (talk) 10:56, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

Regardless if you are confused or not, the bug has no impact on gameplay and is only a minor visual bug, and the fact that you found nothing on it proves that it's so insignificant that no one else has taken the time to mention it.
Cheddar (talk) 11:00, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

┌────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘The other bugs related to the loadout menu are also minor visual bugs that have no impact on gameplay, yet they are listed. Cheezcracker (talk) 11:03, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

There are some visual bugs here, but they're all notable. Having no minimised viewmodel means it can occupy a larger part of the screen than other weapons, which has a gameplay impact. The Hot Hand not appearing when inspecting it from the backpack is a notable bug because it's a whole feature not working. The glove not having a switch animation when switching to the Gas Passer can look very confusing in-game and could have a potential gameplay impact. The Hot Hand not appearing on the Pyro's hand is not really notable, but it's together with the weapon not dropping on death, which is notable. The only thing I would argue as potentially not notable is the arm of the Pyro being more extended. This finger bug is so incredibly minor that it should not be noted. The only argument for it being included is "I personally got confused by this", but as you said with how you can't find anything on this bug from anyone else, it seems like it's just you that has so much trouble with this slight change of finger position.

I'm not sure any more discussing it is worth it, we don't include the Rocket Jumper animation bug where the hand slightly clips through the weapon either for the same reason.
| s | GrampaSwood (talk) (contribs) 11:30, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

The (probable) reason this bug occurs is: both the gas passer and hot hand use the all-class melee animation as a base, and then have modifications applied on-top of it, instead of being its own separate animation. This is why the arm stays extended, and the fingers being the gas passer's fingers (different from all-class melee btw) instead of what it should be is likely due to the animation either pulling the wrong data, or the hot hand is built on top of the gas passer which is built on top of the all class melee animation. That being said, this is a bug, not an oversight like clipping. The loadout screen is supposed to give you an accurate view of what you look like in game, that's a feature, and the feature is failing to work properly. Here is a bug from the voodoo souls: "When playing on DirectX 8, any parts of the Voodoo-Cursed Soul that are normally "carved in", such as the holes and bones on the model, are visible on the class selection menu, loadout menu, and 3D class portrait. This does not affect the in-game model, however." This is a loadout screen exclusive visual bug that has no effect on gameplay, I see these as equal. Cheezcracker (talk) 11:57, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

The difference is that that affects the whole body and looks wildly different from what it actually is in-game. This bug's difference is this versus this. It is a bug, but it's not a bug worth documenting. It's on the same level as clipping, and I'm ending the discussion here.
| s | GrampaSwood (talk) (contribs) 12:01, 13 January 2024 (UTC)