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| − | I'm not really sure why this page is here. The machine is a plot point, but it doesn't seem notable for its own article, especially when all of the information can be found on [[Loose Canon]], [[Mann Manor]], and [[Non-player characters]]. Also, it's orphaned and uncategorized and has incorrect links, grammatical errors, and one edit, the creation of the page. [[User:Tabs|Tabs]] 23:50, 28 January 2012 (PST)
| + | {{Talk archive |
| − | | + | | arc1name = Archive 1 |
| − | == For those who think that's the Admin with Mrk IV and V... ==
| + | | arc1link = Talk:Life Extender Machine/Archive 1 |
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| − | First off, Prior to the story, its only been 6 months. Even if the admin looked like that, she would not need the LEM. She's only in her 50's - 60's (smoking makes you look older, as to Helen smokes a lot), the LEM is only designed to keep a person alive longer than a human body would sustain, for that the australium powering it is known to have intensive physical enhancements. Helen is still physically able, as you saw her with the heavy trench coat wear in ''Blood in the Water''.
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| − | I'm pretty sure it's Emily because she was the one who had convinced Radigan to build the life extending machines. Regardless whether it's Emily or Elizabeth, it is not the current Administrator. The reason of course for building one for Emily remains unknown, but she does have a reason to stay alive, so there's that. Emily also knows about the metric tons of Australium stored away.
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| − | Now I'll admit, Emily was and Administrator, but she retired after the TF2 mercenaries came in (I'm assuming). She shouldn't be called the Administrator otherwise it would cause confusion, not to mention the link led to Helen.
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| − | An interesting twist could be that Gray Mann is Emily, but that is debatable. Why do I think the two could be the same person? Well, there are only 5 LEM in existence. Blutarch had Mrk. 1, Redmond had Mrk. 2, Gray has Mrk. 3, and Emily has Mrk. 4 and 5. but only the Conagher ancestry knows about the plans and no one knew about Gray or who built the LEMs (debatable) in the story. Now true, Gray could've built it himself, but BLU Engie would not have known about it. The current LEMs for Emily should've been Mrk. III and IV then. Unless Emily and Dell knew about Gray before anyone else, this theory is the most probable at this point (that I could think of), at least until the story progresses and reveals more information. Though Emily and Gray's physical features are much, much different, let us recall the ''[[Disguise kit]]'' the Spies own.
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| − | Hell, it could even be the BLU spy. Dell was the only BLU member to appear in the story so far. But like I've said, until the story reveals more information.
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| − | [[User:Naverick22|Naverick22]] ([[User talk:Naverick22|talk]]) 07:55, 9 October 2014 (PDT)
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| − | : First, please understand that [[w: Mark (designation)|''Mark'']] in this usage by convention should refer to advances in stages of development or design, not serial number. So, in conventional usage, the first two, if not all three, would be “Mark I”; and that is only speculation that Dell started his Mark designations with those. Yes, Valve or the authors may have intended to use Mark in a non-standard serialization sense, but even so, the count would be wrong.
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| − | : Second, Naverick22, your count is off, only three have been revealed to have been built by Radigan; only two were on order in 1890. These two were completed in 1894. The third was built in some later year. The count:
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| − | :* Three LEMs are listed as built by Radigan in [[Loose Canon]].
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| − | :* Careful observation of page 6 of [[Blood Brothers]] reveals that Blutarch and Redmond Mann [[:File:Bloodbrothers6.jpg|each have their own “portable” machine]]; so two LEMs are revealed in ''Blood Brothers''; ''three'' if the one Gray’s is wearing is ''not'' the third one mentioned in ''Loose Canon''.
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| − | :* Two are revealed in [[''Blood in the Water'']].
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| − | : That makes at least 7 or 8 LEM, depending on how you count Gray’s or the Mark Four; but you cannot count ''both'' Gray’s and the Mark Four as the third. Now, ''at least'' 5 different basic models have been shown (which if any is Radigan’s third is as yet unknown),
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| − | # Blutarch’s and Redmond’s two 1894 models (maybe the same design, maybe not)
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| − | # Blutarch’s and Redmond’s two recent portable models (maybe the same design, maybe not)
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| − | # Gray’s one back-mounted model
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| − | # The one "Mark Four "
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| − | # The one "Mark Five"
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| − | : Personally, I think it is speculative to assume that only 7 or 8 LEM ''ever'' existed, or to assume that Radigan made the one Gray is wearing in the 1970s, or to assume that only Radigan and Dell are the only ones who could ever make LEM.
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| − | : Until any published revelation to the contrary, ''any'' assignment of Radigan’s “third” LEM to Gray, Elizabeth, Emily, Helen, Lincoln, Radigan, or ''anybody else'' is ''speculation'' and as such should not be stated as anything approaching fact.
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| − | : But if mere exposure to Australium imparts longevity, then why would "Emily" request LEMs?
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| − | : [[User:Mikado282|Mikado282]] ([[User talk:Mikado282|talk]]) 22:15, 30 November 2014 (PST)
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| − | == Re: previous post ==
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| − | I did some more research and here's what I've noticed, a bit late that is. When the Admin came into scene in the first couple of pages of Blood in the water, she had some facial feature similar to that of Emily in page 74. Except fr the chapped lip. If that's the case, this could mean that Helen, Emily, and Elizabeth could all be the same person. Which would the reason for the LEM. The Admin made it clear that she does not condone friendship in the WAR! update. Relationships and affairs then would be let alone. That means she has kept her life extended to as long as the 3 mann brothers. And her eternal love of smoking, which you can see the cigarettes in her first appearance and on page 74.
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| − | I'm still not wrong though, it very well could be Emily and Helen on 74.
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| − | == Restructure, Nov. 2014 ==
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| − | The original article was structured on the assumption that there were just three LEM of one design with no deep involvement in the Storyline; the growth of the LEM into a story arc has more or less been tacked on in places. My intention is to revise the article to fit the Storyline recent development that there are several LEMs and to remove speculation:
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| − | * Largely restructure the article to reflect that the both LEM and Australium story arcs are ongoing.
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| − | ** “… is a large device with many dials, …” LEMs no longer fit that description; move to more appropriate paragraph.
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| − | ** Organize a cogent listing of known LEMs (sans speculation), which should facilitate incorporation of additional revelations.
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| − | ** Add update tag, yes, it is not an update, but the story of LEM and Australium is ongoing
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| − | * Remove speculation:
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| − | ** It may be true that many believe that Gray received the third LEM; but that is not actually revealed, so it is speculation.
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| − | ** Removed "third" from "A third, much more advanced life …" to remove any sense of speculation that Gray’s present model is the third LEM that Radigan made. Even if Gray did receive the third machine, the one he is seen wearing is not necessarily it.
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| − | ** “…it is assumed that …” The wiki should not assume, and if someone is assuming, the wiki should name names.
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| − | ** “…the [[Engineer]] ancestry has built 5 different Life-Extending…” It has not been expressly revealed who made Gray’s present model.
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| − | ** “…sometime in 1970…” removed as much of the 20th century dating as possible, since I’m not entirely sure it is completely settled, Loose Canon and all.
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| − | * Delete "…, but Blutarch warned him not to build one for himself". Actually Blutarch made no such stipulation; rather, Blutarch simply claimed ownership of anything found in the notes.
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| − | ** From the existence certain items, specifically the Sentry, Teleporter, Dispenser, and the Gunslinger in the game, it is implied that Dell either disobeyed or indeed provided the designs to Blutarch, with TF Industries gaining the technologies either way; but that is not relevant to ''this'' article.
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| − | ** The dialog on ''Blood in the Water'', page 69, leaves room for that scene being the first time Dell has seen the Mark Four in her arm (“Damn, that is ''in'' there.”). True or not, it is presently speculation to say Dell made the Mark Four, but reasonable to assume he made the Mark Five.
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| − | * I know Roman numerals is convention for Marks: Yeah, Ogre was one of my favorite paper wargames; but as published, it’s “Mark Four” or “Mark Five”, not “Mark IV” or “Mark V”
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| − | [[User:Mikado282|Mikado282]] ([[User talk:Mikado282|talk]]) 22:22, 30 November 2014 (PST)
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| − | : I decided against the tag. I am thinking that the one trivium can be deleted since it is covered by the body of the article. [[User:Mikado282|Mikado282]] ([[User talk:Mikado282|talk]]) 03:39, 1 December 2014 (PST)
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