Talk:Weapons

Details

I'm new here, which will explain my question. What is the meaning of the two headings in the icon column, "backpack" and "kill"? Perhaps a text legend should be added with links to pages that have a longer explanation would be in order. RobShaver 18:38, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Should we have a "Details" or "Special" column that summarizes special attributes and non-weapon weapons (Wrangler, lunchbox items, backburner, etc.)? Strange Quirk 01:04, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Perhaps, but I don't think it'd fit horizontally on small screens D: — Wind 01:19, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

The Icon column is for two things, the backpack icon, and the kill icon. There really isn't an explanation needed. As for an additional column, the details are all located on the weapon page, this page is merely for summarizing all the specific statistics of the weapon for comparison and reference. A "details" section may make it look a bit bloated. --Firestorm   18:44, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

I've changed the Icon column so it's a bit more specific. Thoughts? --Firestorm   18:55, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Actually, before the move we were considering removing the weapon damage columns so that changed values only had to be kept updated on the individual weapon pages themselves, with this page acting more as a sort of hub. This would also free up some space for a details section which could describe the weapon attributes in brief. Smash is okay with it last I checked, anyone against this? --Wilsonator 19:26, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

I prefer having the damage column here. I think a details section is unnecessary, as once you know the details of a weapon, you won't forget it, but you will forget the damage often. I like being able to compare the point-blank damage of the FaN and Scattergun (for example) and notice that a crit FaN will NOT kill a Soldier in one hit, where that info would normally be buried and not noticed as easily in the individual weapon page --Firestorm   19:32, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Damage Per Second?

Should we have a column for DPS? If people think the table would be too wide, should we include it in the weapon pages? Its useful information, especially when comparing weapons. If it were up to me, I would have a "short term DPS" which would only take into account time between shots, and "long term DPS" which would account for reload times, but that might be overkill. Still, how else are you going to easily find out which weapons can take out a building in the shortest time? Strange Quirk 02:54, 24 July 2010 (UTC)

I'll add it if I don't get a response. Strange Quirk 12:38, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

I wouldn't say there's much need for a DPS column. While it's increasingly RPGish, TF2 is still an FPS and taking imperfect aim, the generally short and explosive nature of the combat, the fact you're usually fighting more than one opponent and the firing rates of all the weapons into account, getting a standardised DPS for every one would be difficult and probably not useful enough to make it worth it. When it comes to taking out buildings, it's more down to general knowledge and the strategy sections, just a short note in the minigun/flamethrower descriptions about how they're ideal for taking out SGs would do the same thing. That and it'd be hell updating it for every weapons page and on this page whenever valve patches the damage values for a weapon. --Wilsonator 15:24, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, we've talked about this before. If the person really wants to know it, they can figure it out using base damage and attack interval. --Firestorm   15:59, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

Eh, ok. Though if you want to take into account reload times its not completely trivial. I'm not going to press it further, but i think that at least for the miniguns and flamethrowers we should have DPS instead of bullet/particle damage, since those are pretty useless. Strange Quirk 19:19, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

The DPS is listed on the individual weapon pages for those weapons --Firestorm   19:29, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

Hidden attributes

Since it applies to multiple weapons, I'm putting it here. If you look on TF2Items/items_game.txt, you can see that certain hidden attributes present on some weapons are down right weird...

Huntsman: Primary max ammo bonus (0.5) (37=0.5)

As far as I know, you have less arrows than bullets with the sniper rifle.

Crit-a-cola: Lunch box adds mini-crits (2)

This is right under the visible "Mini-crit" attribute, so I don't know what that means.

Also, the Flare gun has an hidden attribute which is "Secondary max ammo penalty", which makes sense since it does have less ammo than the shotgun.

We're getting trolled hard by Valve D: -- Vi3trice _(talk) 18:37, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

the 0.5 "bonus" turns 25 sniper bullets into 12 arrows. A lot of these are hidden attributes because they are understood by the weapon's nature, or in the case of the huntsman/flare gun are significantly different from their base weapon, so it's unnecessary to state such attributes, because players can assume that they would be different. -- Nineaxis 19:15, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

Including adding nonsensical names to it? I mean, it says bonus. It's almost as weird as Robin hitting the server with sticks. -- Vi3trice _(talk) 19:23, 12 August 2010 (UTC)