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| − | __TOC__
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| − | {{discussion close}} | + | | arc1link = Talk:Flame Thrower/Archive 1 |
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| − | Move complete, I'm going to go ahead and put this section on top of the page for future reference and so that people don't see the previous one first and have a knee jerk reaction. -- [[User:Lagg|Lagg]] [[File:Backpack_Stickybomb_Launcher.png|24px|link=User_talk:Lagg]] 14:27, 26 March 2012 (PDT)
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| − | == Requested move ==
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| − | The discussion above has been brought up more than once before, but the problem is that the arguments contained therein are a bit weak. The fixes that need to be done from moves, even now when we have more automated tools and templates are fairly small. <b>Technical accuracy is not a bad thing</b> and because of the glory of redirects searches will not be affected. The vast majority of page titles we have now match item names. We may as well tie the last few ends -- [[User:Lagg|Lagg]] [[File:Backpack_Stickybomb_Launcher.png|24px|link=User_talk:Lagg]] 15:02, 25 March 2012 (PDT)
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| − | :{{c|Support}} All that'll be affected is the title of the page, which should reflect the exact wording of the actual item in-game. Simple as. '''» [[User:Cooper Kid|<span style="color:red">Coo</span><span style ="color:gray">per</span><span style ="color:blue"> Kid</span>]]''' <small>([[User_talk:Cooper Kid|blether]]) • ([[Special:Contributions/Cooper Kid|contreebs]])</small> 15:04, 25 March 2012 (PDT)
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| − | :{{c|support|1}} {{user:r4wrz0rz0r/sig/actual}} 15:06, 25 March 2012 (PDT)
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| − | :{{c|Support}} [[User:Calq|Calq]] 15:15, 25 March 2012 (PDT)
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| − | :{{c|support}} It is much easier to verify and update information when the names on the wiki and the game files match, especially if English is not your native language. — [[User:C2Talon|C2Talon]] (<i>[[Special:Contributions/C2Talon|c]]</i>/<i>[[User_talk:C2Talon|t]]</i>) 15:36, 25 March 2012 (PDT)
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| − | {{discussion close|footer}}
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| − | {{discussion close}}
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| − | == Requested move ==
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| − | :{{c|minus|Not moving}}: it has become clear that a move to the title "Flame Thrower" would be against the wishes of the community. Despite being the used title for the weapon in-game, "Flame Thrower" is not favoured over the current title for the article at this time. [[User:Seb26|<font color="#0B61A4">'''seb26'''</font>]] [[User talk:Seb26|<span style="font-size:95%;">[talk]</span>]] 21:15, 24 September 2010 (UTC)
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| − | <hr />
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| − | This quote should help those still undecided to make their decision. -- [[User:Benjamuffin|'''Benjamuffin''']] [[File:BenjamuffinSig.png|Om nom nom!]] 05:22, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | {{Quotation|'''Robin Walker''' on titles/weapon names|Looking at the in-game localization text, I can see we’re already inconsistent ourselves, so I don’t think it’s a big issue. I’d pick whichever one you want to go with, and call it that. If you get nitpickers complaining about it, add a note to the pages saying that the game itself is inconsistent.}}
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| − | '''Flame Thrower vs Flamethrower'''
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| − | In-game, this weapon is referred to as the Flame Thrower. -[[User:Shine|<font color="#666666">'''Shine'''</font>]] ({{mod}}) 15:47, 17 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Support}}: -[[User:Shine|<font color="#666666">'''Shine'''</font>]] ({{mod}}) 15:52, 17 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Support|Weak support}}: My support for this is a little weaker, as Valve always refer to this as "Flamethrower" everywhere outside of the backpack. -- [[User:Pilk|Pilk]] <sub>([[User talk:Pilk|talk]])</sub> 16:01, 17 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Oppose}}: I much prefer Flamethrower. It's a real-life term that's used in-game and I have never heard anyone refer to it as a Flame thrower. Also, the backpack/items is the ONLY place where it is referred to as such, everywhere else is flamethrower --[[User:Firestorm|<font color="#FF6600"><tt><big><u>'''Firestorm'''</u></big></tt></font>]] {{mod}} 16:03, 17 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Oppose}}: Flamethrower works, and it is often reffered to as such. -- [[User:Smashman|Smashman...]] {{bur}} <sub>([[User_talk:Smashman|t]] • <span class="plainlinks">[http://www.steamcommunity.com/id/smashman2004 s])</span></sub> 17:14, 17 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Support|Support}}: While "Flamethrower" is more correct, if Flame Thrower is the in-game name, that ''is'' what we should follow. -- [[User:Nineaxis|<span style="color:#FF8C00;font-weight:bold">Nineaxis</span>]] {{mod}} [[File:User Nineaxis sig duck.png|12px]] 17:21, 17 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :: I just saw an tip on the loading screen which used "flame thrower", so the backpack name isn't the only place there is the space. -- [[User:Nineaxis|<span style="color:#FF8C00;font-weight:bold">Nineaxis</span>]] {{mod}} [[File:User Nineaxis sig duck.png|12px]] 22:18, 17 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Oppose}}: Valve refers to this as both the Flamethrower ''and'' the Flame Thrower, so this seems a bit unnecessary. Furthermore, as far as I can see, the TF2 community likes to refer to this weapon as the Flamethrower. -[[User:The Neotank|<font color="#FF8C00">'''The Neotank'''</font>]] ({{mod}}<small> | [[User talk:The Neotank|Talk]]</small>) [[File:User The Neotank Signeotank.jpg]] 22:30, 17 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{C|Oppose}}: Flame Thrower sounds like fire breathing to me — [[User:WindPower|<span style="font-weight:bold;">Wind</span>]] {{adm}} 01:28, 18 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Support}}: If we change one weapon to match the in-game spelling, we have to do that for all of them. We can't pick and choose based on if we like it or not. It's inconsistent. -- [[User:En_Ex|En Ex]] {{bur}} <sub>([[User_talk:En_Ex|talk]])</sub> 02:09, 18 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Support|Support}}: I agree with Nineaxis. We have to document what the item name is in-game. The only reason I see the community and Valve using the correct term, is because that is on web pages/forums, so naturally it's not as solid as it is in-game. People likely don't pay attention when writing articles and forum posts, and probably just automatically type flamethrower, whereas other times, they may have made a mistake, or remembered the in-game title. At the end of the day, being a wiki for Team Fortress 2, I think it should be Flame Thrower till the in-game names change to reflect accuracy. The same applies for the other items.-- [[User:Benjamuffin|'''Benjamuffin''']] [[File:BenjamuffinSig.png|Om nom nom!]] 06:22, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :: It might be worth adding a trivia piece regardless of what is chosen. For example: if Flamethrower, "In-game the Flamethrower is titled Flame Thrower, regardless of this being incorrect in reality" and if Flame Thrower, "Though the item is titled Flame Thrower in-game, the correct term is Flamethrower". -- [[User:Benjamuffin|'''Benjamuffin''']] [[File:BenjamuffinSig.png|Om nom nom!]] 06:26, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Oppose}}: Basically what Firest orm said.--[[User:Nelson340|Nelson340]] 21:32, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Oppose}}: Sounds strange. And it is a Flamethrower, not a Flame Thrower. --[[User:Picard|Picard]] {{loc|de}} 14:54, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Oppose}}: Flame Thrower looks bizzare. One exception should not be the defined rule. [[User:Noizeblaze|Noizeblaze]] 17:15, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Comment}}: How about having the article name be Flame_Thrower, but with DISPLAYTITLE Flamethrower? That way it's consistent URL-wise (works with item ID redirection script without redirects) but still displays the correct name for a weapon that spews flame — [[User:WindPower|<span style="font-weight:bold;">Wind</span>]] {{adm}} 17:45, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | ::This is an excellent point... same with [[SMG]] maybe? -- [[User:Pilk|Pilk]] <sub>([[User talk:Pilk|talk]])</sub> 18:26, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :::I think that's a bad idea. I've never been been a fan of DISPLAYTITLE. It definitely should not be used on English pages. It'll just confuse the users. -- [[User:Smashman|Smashman...]] {{bur}} <sub>([[User_talk:Smashman|t]] • <span class="plainlinks">[http://www.steamcommunity.com/id/smashman2004 s])</span></sub> 18:42, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :::: I don't know what's wrong with DISPLAYTITLE and I don't understand your third sentence --[[User:Firestorm|<font color="#FF6600"><tt><big><u>'''Firestorm'''</u></big></tt></font>]] {{mod}} 19:02, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | ::A nice suggestion, but this I think would only create further confusion between displayed name and actual article name. [[User:Seb26|<font color="#0B61A4">'''seb26'''</font>]] <span style="font-size:95%;">[[User talk:Seb26|[talk]]]</span> 20:46, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :::I've always disliked DISPLAYTITLE and on Wikipedia it's outright disabled because looking at a title should instantly inform you as to which article you're on. For example, at the moment we have language pages that completely change the name of the article, I guess that's ok, but if it's the same as the English name, you have to look at the URL to see what language you're on. (Assuming you can't guess what language it is from the content). {{n}}[[User:Smashman|<span class="bur">Smashman</span>]]<sub> ([[User_talk:Smashman|talk]])</sub> {{bur}} 12:05, 5 September 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Oppose}}. Currently, moving the page, fixing redirects, fixing all instances of the old name, etc, it all doesn't seem worth it just to be "accurate". ''Flamethrower'' is the term used greatly by the community and in the game and it should stay used by our articles – it does not make sense to change it all for what might even have been a mistake on Valve's part. [[User:Seb26|<font color="#0B61A4">'''seb26'''</font>]] <span style="font-size:95%;">[[User talk:Seb26|[talk]]]</span> 20:46, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Oppose}}: Mixed bag due to the way it's used in-game, but I'd rather stick to "Flamethrower." -- [[User:Vi3trice|<font color=#771d6d>'''Vi3trice'''</font>]] {{adm}} <sub>([[User_talk:Vi3trice|talk]])</sub> 22:51, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Oppose}}: It's only referred to as the Flame Thrower in one place and Flamethrower looks better to the eye. - [[User:Not an IP|Not an IP]] 21:41, 22 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :: {{c|Comment}} It's referred to as "Flame Thrower" in the loading menu tips as well as the backpack name. So that's more than one place. -- [[User:Nineaxis|<span style="color:#FF8C00;font-weight:bold">Nineaxis</span>]] {{mod}} [[File:User Nineaxis sig duck.png|12px]] 22:48, 22 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :: Guys, though I already stated my thoughts above, I decided to ask Robin if he knew which were intentional and which were mistakes, and to see if he had any official view on the subject. He mailed me back with:
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| − | :: "Looking at the in-game localization text, I can see we’re already inconsistent ourselves, so I don’t think it’s a big issue. I’d pick whichever one you want to go with, and call it that. If you get nitpickers complaining about it, add a note to the pages saying that the game itself is inconsistent."
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| − | :: So in short, we just have to pick whichever looks/feels best, and donʻt have to worry about what it says in-game or which is more accurate. There is still a small matter of debate, but itʻs more about which looks better, is accurate, rather than what it is in-game or what is accurate to the Team Fortress universe.
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| − | :: My opinion is now: Übersaw as it is German, it helps you always pronounce it correctly, and seems the likely one of the two, Medigun as for me the word Medi feels unfinished, and Flamethrower, due to it being the accurate term (my original opinion was to mirror the game and be Flame Thrower, so this changed my view somewhat :D). -- [[User:Benjamuffin|'''Benjamuffin''']] [[File:BenjamuffinSig.png|Om nom nom!]] 17:58, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | ::: That all sounds reasonable to me --[[User:Firestorm|<font color="#FF6600"><tt><big><u>'''Firestorm'''</u></big></tt></font>]] {{mod}} 18:07, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Support}}: Because [[Tough Guy's Toque]] is a tuque. If we're gonna canon-troll with names, we may as well go all in. [[User:MK|MK]] 06:31, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Oppose}}: Why make a move just because of where it is mentioned once? The backpack refers to it as Flame Thrower, yes, but... the actual IRL thing is spelled flamethrower, it is called flamethrower in the game files, in the console's kill list, the Pyro Update page, in general TF2 community speak, etc. I believe a move to "Flame Thrower" would be entirely pointless and a waste of time and would only cause redirects on the wiki and possible confusion among the community. [[User:Stbeecher|Stbeecher]] 06:34, 5 September 2010 (UTC)
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| − | ::{{c}}: It appears that the achievements have it named as the flamethrower too. Interesting. {{n}}[[User:Smashman|<span class="bur">Smashman</span>]]<sub> ([[User_talk:Smashman|talk]])</sub> {{bur}} 12:01, 5 September 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Oppose}}: Flamethrower is proper. It seems quite likely that even Valve will end up correcting this, since they refer to it as "flamethrower" nowadays outside of the game itself, anyway. [[User:Ryusuta|Ryusuta]] 18:55, 9 September 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Oppose}}: It's a flamethrower. "Flame thrower" only appears twice; flamethrower is the correct and more widely-used name. [[User:Tentacle|Tentacle]] 19:46, 10 September 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Oppose}}: Well, Google and Wikipedia have it as one word, not two. [[User:RogueDarkJedi|-- RogueDarkJedi]] 01:42, 11 September 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Oppose}}: Well guys, I've just done a quick count and at the moment it's five supporting, and fifteen opposing, sixteen if you include my vote. Ben seems to have changed his mind, and Robin seems to admit that there's no real point in being this detail consistent. [[File:Infisig.png|60x60px|link=User:Infi^|Infi^]] {{adm}} 03:46, 11 September 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :{{c|Oppose}}: Same reasoning as WDJ. Perhaps the TF2 wiki should introduce a similar policy to Wikipedia's [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:COMMONNAME#Common_names Common Name] article naming convention...? --[[User:Leftism|Leftism]] 15:57, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
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| − | ::{{c|Comment}}: That's not a bad idea at all... {{n}}[[User:Smashman|<span class="bur">Smashman</span>]]<sub> ([[User_talk:Smashman|talk]])</sub> {{bur}} 16:00, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
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| − | {{discussion close|footer}}
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| − | == Mini-Crits ==
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| − | I do not see anywhere in this article where it mentions airblasted projectiles become mini-crits. Add this? [[User:Nequissime|Nequissime]] 20:45, 13 October 2010 (UTC)
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| − | :Still no relevant information pertaining to this. How do you suppose we implement it? [[User:Squidfeeder|Squidfeeder]] 21:20, 24 January 2011 (UTC)
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| − | ==Loadout Stats name==
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| − | Although it is spelled differently for the article's title, shouldn't the name in the loadout stats picture shown in the article match the loadout stats picture shown in-game? [[User:Rolandius|Rolandius]] 09:52, 13 August 2011 (PDT)
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| − | :I just changed this. I also did the same thing for the [[Übersaw]] a few days ago when I removed some pointless spelling trivia. [[User:Dragonsbrethren|Dragonsbrethren]] 07:33, 23 August 2011 (PDT)
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| − | == Damage discrepancy ==
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| − | There is a claim in the introduction that ~22.5 particles are generated per second, causing maximum 139.5dps (which is stated elsewhere in the wiki). However in the weapon stats box the interval time is claimed at 0.04, which would be 25 particles a second or 165dps. Can we confirm which is the correct value and adjust the page accordingly? [[User:Camillo|Camillo]] 15:48, 1 November 2011 (PDT)
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| − | :1 in 25 is 0.04. 1 in 22.5 is 0.044444444444444444444444444444444444444444444-you get my point. I think this is the result of rounding off the number. Come to think of it, I don't think I have ever seen data on the Wiki that went past the two decimals. So I'm pretty sure it's due to rounding. Could be fixed by adding an extra 4 though. -- <span style="font-family:TF2 Build;font-size:90%;">[[File:Killicon train.png|40px|link=User:Hefaistus]] [[User:Hefaistus|<font color="#FF9933">Hefaistus</font>]]</span> - [[User talk:Hefaistus|<span style="color:black;font-size:82%;">talk</span>]] 16:07, 1 November 2011 (PDT)
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| − | :: Main body of the wiki says 25; that's fine as a rounding generalisation; but the infobox that is based on says interval of 0.04. The infobox should be as accurate as possible; and shotguns go to 3 decimal places anyway (0.625s). If there is a recurring decimal, it should be indicated in the notation - ideally via a vinculum as per US notation. RE: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Repeating_decimal#Notation [[User:Ace42|Ace42]] ([[User talk:Ace42|talk]]) 08:05, 28 January 2015 (PST)
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| − | == Blowtorch Concept ==
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| − | Anyone know why it's there? Was the blowtorch intended to be the original flamethrower or something? There's no associated trivia with it. -- [[User:Mexican|Mexican]] 12:53, 9 February 2012 (PST)
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| − | == Forward/Backward movment ==
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| − | Particles in the flame thrower actually move depending on the player,
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| − | <br>if the user is walking backwards while shooting flames and another walks forward into said flames the other user will cause himself more damage.
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| − | <br>Something similar (kind of) was shown in the [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jPYmiJ8qoZQ&feature=player_detailpage#t=54s Righteous Bison demonstration video].
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| − | <br>Should this be mentioned in this weapon demonstration video?
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| − | P.S. It's a great method for Pyro fights where none seem consider air-blast. [[User:Reconciliation-|<span style="color:#262626;">'''Reconciliation-'''</span>]] • [[User_talk:Reconciliation-|<span style="color:#262626;">'''Talk'''</span>]] 05:22, 2 May 2012 (PDT)
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| − | :{{c|support}} This is a thing for strafing as well and is an essential mechanic for m1 aim. How is it not included yet? [[User:Jediflamaster|Jediflamaster]] ([[User talk:Jediflamaster|talk]]) 02:03, 18 November 2015 (PST)
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| − | == 3D image ==
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| − | The non-festive 3D images have been broken since this article was moved from Flamethrower to Flame Thrower. I'd fix it myself, but I don't know how. [[User:Dragonsbrethren|Dragonsbrethren]] 09:43, 29 June 2012 (PDT)
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| − | == Information regarding Flamethrower damage and Damage Spread ==
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| − | I'm not too keen on what this means, exactly, but, apparently, the Flamethrower and Backburner obtain a DPS increase when random damage spread is disabled.
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| − | [http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2787539 Source].
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| − | -[[User:KajiVena|KajiVena of TheVille]] 21:53, 5 July 2012 (PDT)
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| − | == Flamethrower Mojo : Range bugs ==
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| − | * The range of all of the Pyro's flamethrowers is not consistent. The origin point of hitboxes varies depending on the way a player's ping has been changing, resulting in an extended or shortened range. This can make players with identical pings have different range.
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| − | TMP explaining how to use ping spikes to a player's advantage
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| − | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSB4ywcE528
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| − | In-depth video on gameplay consequences, this one is a bit old, from before I knew why this happens.
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| − | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sh3gPQuVCWo
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| − | Side view of the bug with simulated ping and Ft hitboxes
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| − | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UioPlbdgZPY
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| − | [[User:Jediflamaster|Jediflamaster]] ([[User talk:Jediflamaster|talk]]) 19:31, 17 November 2015 (PST)
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| − | == Afterburn healing & resists ==
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| − | According from the recent edit by [[User:Evanjohnman]], he stated that
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| − | * The Flame Thrower's Medi Gun heal and resist reduction is not actually 25%.
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| − | ** Healing is reduced by 50% with Medi Guns, and by 100%/100%/75% with level 1/2/3 dispensers, respectively.
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| − | ** The resistance reduction applies to Vaccinator Über '''only'''. It does not apply to the passive Vaccinator resistance.
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| − | Any solid evidence on these? Since this was added without any evidences behind. [[File:User Hinaomi Hinaomi-sig.png|link=User:Hinaomi]] [[User:Hinaomi|Rikka Takanashi]] <small>([[User talk:Hinaomi|talk]]) • ([[Special:Contributions/Hinaomi|contributions]])</small> 08:13, 27 August 2018 (UTC)
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| − | : Just check IRC right now lol, all of this is true, save for resistance reduction - but I might have tested it incorrectly; also, airblast doesn't push people from behind - there's that. Evidence 1 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Yo3RnL401w ; Evidence 2 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYfx64j3BGc (older video, but the mechanic hasn't changed one bit, so still relevant) [[User:Goodjob|Goodjob]] ([[User talk:Goodjob|talk]]) 10:03, 27 August 2018 (UTC)
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| − | :: (I don't sign in here often lol) I was planning to upload a video of my findings to YT, but it was late (3 AM), and I forgot to upload it. It was negligent on my part and I apologize. [[User:Evanjohnman|TheGrammarJew]] ([[User talk:Evanjohnman|talk]]) 21:58, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
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| − | == Space in the name? ==
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| − | I noticed a small inconsistency. The item is called the "Flame Thrower", yet every time it's mentioned here, it uses "Flamethrower". Wouldn't it be more accurate to include the space since that's how it's spelled in game? --[[User:ChainSmoker82|ChainSmoker82]] ([[User talk:ChainSmoker82|talk]]) 20:05, 11 May 2021 (UTC)
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| − | == Damage per "particle" in Damage Table ==
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| − | Damage per "particle" is misleading. Post-Jungle Inferno, flame particles don't damage targets individually, but this wording implies they do.
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| − | I'm not sure what to change it to as "tick" is already used, but a different length of time. This also applies to the other flame throwers, so I decided to make this post first before hastily making the changes to every page.
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| − | [[User:Stack man|Stack man]] ([[User talk:Stack man|talk]]) 08:28, 6 January 2022 (UTC)
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