Talk:Black Rose/Archive 1

The following discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it.

Untitled-Topic

Speculation: If anyone actually knows about what the promo is for that would be awesome. I personally think its for the Rusty Hearts character Roselle Vergerius. She's not part of the default game, so based on her name...I think its kind of obvious. Steam hasn't shed any light on it. Muffalopadus 16:50, 14 February 2012 (PST)

Just a note: The model has been added to the game, but as of yet, the item is not usable in itemtest, and does not even have animations. Piogre 21:43, 14 February 2012 (PST)

Promo Item

This item is related to a F2P game known as Alliance of Valiant Arms.

You can see an exact replica of the knife during this customization menu:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_cc6qWNFTEQ

Does anybody have any idea how it's obtained if it is actually from AVA? --Chocolate Rain! 17:15, 14 February 2012 (PST)

Like most promos, the item comes out before the criteria for obtaining it, so just sit tight, there'll probably be an AVA update within the next week. The Riet 18:21, 14 February 2012 (PST)

Someone at Steam Forums said that you have to buy every weapon in the game's store. - J.P. 18:40, 14 February 2012 (PST)

SPUF says a lot of things, very few of them are true. Just a Gigolo - (talk) 18:45, 14 February 2012 (PST)

To buy every weapon in the store, you would need to spend roughly $100. So, no. --— The preceding unsigned comment was added by Marceline (talk) • (contribs)

There's apparently a Black Rose in the game that costs 7 gold in the game, and it's rumored buying it in game gives it to you in TF2 as well. Jouva 18:56, 14 February 2012 (PST)

@Gigolo: Indeed. But i couldn't know that it would cost that much, since the game isn't available here. - J.P. 19:17, 14 February 2012 (PST)

I bought the item in AVA, I haven't received it in Team Fortress. TecHXeoZ 20:25, 14 February 2012 (PST)

Maybe we need to wait for achievements to get it. Until now it is unknown, we just have to wait. TheDoctor 20:28, 14 February 2012 (PST)

Looks exactly like the AVA one, so they probably are somehow related --> Pic from an AVA developer ~ RedXM T • C • S 20:53, 14 February 2012 (PST) this is going to be dumb if it makes you buy feom the ava store. Kvncnh

I wouldn't say exactly. The one is the game is just a normal knife, where this knife is a butterfly knife. They're most likely linked, but we can't be 100% sure until they tell us. Just a Gigolo - (talk) 22:46, 14 February 2012 (PST)

Probably just another reskin from the normal knife, but it looks awesome though. Downy 02:11, 15 February 2012 (PST)

I made a comparison image in Paint. Image. SSF2Zelda 08:01, 15 February 2012 (PST)

Sure, it's similar looking compared to the AVA weapon, but should we wait until we get something official before we link it to this game based on rumour and hearsay? --Lord Carol 15:23, 15 February 2012 (PST)

Yeah, under normal circumstances i would say yes. But this game has no sequel/prequel game announced. So we can be pretty sure that this is the game. But if we are wrong, we could all be punished, oh my please be right wiki ;( TheDoctor 15:32, 15 February 2012 (PST)

A tf2 Tech said the item would become a genuine when it was made craftable, should i add it on the trivia section?Draforce94 14:50, 19 February 2012 (PST)

That seems highly unlikely but do you have any proof? —Moussekateer·talk 14:52, 19 February 2012 (PST)

Unfortunately, no. Hence asking about adding it or not :D.Draforce94 14:55, 19 February 2012 (PST)

Then it would be speculation I'm afraid, and that does not belong on the wiki. —Moussekateer·talk 14:57, 19 February 2012 (PST)

You're right =/, sorry, i'm new here. Still,i call dibs if such a thing happens :D --— The preceding unsigned comment was added by Draforce94 (talk) • (contribs)

Known Damage/Function for this Weapon?

Just out of curiosity, how are the damage/function time already known for this weapon? Correct me, if I am wrong, but hasn't this weapon not even been wielded in the game and tested that it shares identical damage/function time as the Spy's knife? Or are these numbers coming from somewhere else?

I just would like to know how items' damage/function times are derived (it could be I am missing something). It *could* be a reskin, but if it isn't tested, how can one be 100% certain? Jumping the gun on an item could backfire (no pun intended), should Valve introduce a new genuine item with new stats (i.e. Dues Ex promo items).

General Veers 06:47, 15 February 2012 (PST)

Knowing VALVe, this'll probably be just another reskin of the butterfly knife. Downy 07:37, 15 February 2012 (PST)

They are derived from the fact that, at the moment, the weapon is based on the tf_weapon_knife weapon class according to the schema, and has no overriding attributes which make it unique. This is subject to change at any moment, as the knife is lacking animations which would allow it to be used in-game, and Valve could add stat changes when they add the necessary animations. i-ghost 07:41, 15 February 2012 (PST)

Thank you, i-ghost. General Veers 09:13, 15 February 2012 (PST)

I've just received the weapon at 9:20 PM, Eastern Time. It's just another reskin, but it looks kinda nice. It's got a nice rose pattern on the blade. I've already rendered a replay as a weapon demostration. Here's the link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jq84uF1ZQ8c&feature=youtube_gdata NikolaiKrstic 09:59, 16 February 2012 (EST)

Weapom Image

Anyone find any image on the Black rose tell me if you did on my talk thanks :D Lockon 07:41, 15 February 2012 (PST)Lockon

There is a image of the black rose on the top right of the black rose's page. Downy 08:27, 15 February 2012 (PST)

My video of it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jq84uF1ZQ8c&feature=youtube_gdata NikolaiKrstic 10:02, 16 February 2012 (EST)

Sniper Achievements

The sniper achievements has a massive gap between it, can somebody fix it? Lockon 01:32, 16 February 2012 (PST)Lockon

The only way can fix is wait for demonstration. Hinaomi 02:15, 16 February 2012 (PST)

AVA Achievement

Would it be appropriate to include the related achievement for AVA? Its a pretty easy one, but since its related to the item I figured that it might be part of the wiki. Muffalopadus 12:05, 16 February 2012 (PST)

I completed the achievement, haven't got the knife yet though. Downy 12:33, 16 February 2012 (PST)

Self comment, didn't read the steam page. The "Black Rose" will be available later today. Downy 12:36, 16 February 2012 (PST)

Can't be giftwrapped.

Black Rose (currently) cannot be giftwrapped. Dunno if that should go under bugs or trivia, or neither. What a pain. DarkQuill 00:39, 17 February 2012 (PST)

Neither. It is already illustrated in the weapon stats that this weapon is not giftable. General Veers 05:56, 23 February 2012 (PST)

How to Unlock

Guys go check the TF2 website, the black rose is now unlockable by completing the AVA achievement, "1st One Down", to unlock the TF2 item and you'll also receive the TF2-inspired "Holy Mackerel" for your A.V.A. character! Lockon 02:44, 17 February 2012 (PST)Lockon

Default Image

The team colored style is the default style, is it possible to have the RED 3D style as the default, rather than the black style? Balladofwindfishes 13:03, 22 February 2012 (PST)

I think you should ask at 3D model page.... Hinaomi 06:33, 27 February 2012 (PST)

Reference or Note?

The line in the Reference section of this weapon's page sounds more like a note to me. Thoughts? Not Thinking 13:08, 24 February 2012 (PST)

That "reference" refers back to a bug that was already noted under the "Bugs" section. It shouldn't belong under the "References" section. General Veers 06:46, 27 February 2012 (PST)

I'll remove it. Hinaomi 08:22, 27 February 2012 (PST)

 Done Hinaomi 08:24, 27 February 2012 (PST)

Should this be mentioned somewhere? Probably Trivia?

What I found on some guys backpack seems to be a single of a kind BlackRose that is marked as 'Stock Item' (Grey Color) and tradable. Here's the screenshot I took: Stock Black Rose. The guy told me he doesn't exactly know what happened. He has written down a story on TF2Outpost, so you can check that aswell...: Stock Black Rose on TF2Outpost Here the backpack link: Blackrose Backpack Stock Item My question is, should it be noted that a Stock Item of it exists or is it unnecessary... — The preceding unsigned comment was added by T-Wayne (talk) • (contribs) 12:15, 15 May 2012

Item bug maybe? TNS 03:17, 15 May 2012 (PDT)

I think I'll add to Bug Section because this item must be unique quality. Anyway if someone want to change to trivia or remove it, talk in this talk page first with your reason. Hinaomi 11:01, 16 May 2012 (PDT)

Tradability of the item

Hi, i edited the article today, since there is a wrong information about the tradability of the item. In fact, this knife was never tradable and still it is only given out with the "Not Tradable" tag on it. My edit was reverted soon with a reference to the April 18th patch.

The release notes of the April 18th patch falsely said, that the item was made tradable, which is not the case.

So i think, the information in the article should reflect the given facts, not a false information taken from some release notes. Black Rose was never, is not and will never be tradable, according to information from Valve support.

Regards, kyselak aka wicked nasty funkdoctor -- Kyselak 15:14, 22 June 2012 (PDT)

From April 18, 2012 Patch patch note, It was made tradable. But your edit said "The Black Rose was made giftable in the April 18, 2012 Patch" but it was made giftable in March 15, 2012 Patch. I revert back with this reason. Hinaomi 15:17, 22 June 2012 (PDT)

The patch note needs to stay, it's a patch note, so even if it didn't work, it still "happened" and needs to be recorded. Valve forgot to add the attribute that forces tradability on achievement items. Balladofwindfishes 15:19, 22 June 2012 (PDT)

However, the item is not tradable. But the info box says "Tradable: Yes". This is just wrong and should be fixed, no matter what some release notes say. No achievement item has ever been made tradable so far, afaik. Some of them are giftable, but not all. Kyselak 15:33, 22 June 2012 (PDT)

Yea, I suppose this is an awkward situation because it's technically set to be tradable, but the achievement overwrites it. There is an attribute ("always tradable") to force trading on any item, which they need to add to it to make it tradable. Balladofwindfishes 15:43, 22 June 2012 (PDT)

Common sense would dictate changing the infobox tradability information to No. Despite what Valve say the current information is wrong and misleading to users. —Moussekateer·talk 15:45, 22 June 2012 (PDT)

Thank you. This misinformation already caused some confusion on steam support, since some users tried to get tradable versions of this item, referring to the information on the wiki, which even worked in a few cases: http://stats.teamfortress.org/item/727/The_Black_Rose -- Kyselak 16:00, 22 June 2012 (PDT)

I also edited the "Update history" section and the April 18 release notes page, since the wrong information about the Black Rose becoming tradable was removed from the official patch release notes long before and this misinformation is still leading to some confusion in the TF2 community. http://wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/April_18,_2012_Patch / http://www.teamfortress.com/post.php?id=7773 Kyselak 13:00, 1 July 2012 (PDT)

Page is missing Mystery and true love styles

Viewmodels are missing. Could someone add those back in? Ferox 11:34, 8 March 2013 (PST)

They're already present in the viewmodel gallery as the default entries, the first four images.COBALT 11:38, 8 March 2013 (PST)

I think he is talking about 3D model that missing the Mystery and true love style. Rikka Takanashi (talk) • (contributions) 17:23, 8 March 2013 (PST)

Something Weird about the Baccara Style...

I have the Black Rose set to the Baccara Style, and whenever I press Fire, the Spy does a backstab animation. There was nobody in range for me to do a backstab, and when I tried to do the same with the Mystery and True Love Style, the Spy did the normal Knife swing. Is this intentional, or is it a bug of some sort? M15513c0mm4nd (talk) 10:55, 27 July 2014 (PDT)

I've just tested this, and I couldn't replicate this at all. --Omolong (talk) 11:06, 27 July 2014 (PDT)

Craftable

Update History Fix Needed?: On backpack.tf there are tradeable craftable black roses being sold...I think so, anyway. Someone who knows what they are doing check http://backpack.tf/stats/Unique/Black%20Rose/Tradable/Craftable and see if the update history needs to be added to. Thanks! Dr. Betelgeuse 13:27, 12 July 2015 (CT)

Accord to the patch note, they quickly fixed that in the next patch. (July 3rd, 2015) I think it's gonna be hard to list all of them... Rikka Takanashi (talk) • (contributions) 17:41, 12 July 2015 (PDT)

Recent news on AVA

After checking the news, it seems like the game has been taken down 'temporary' due the changing hand of publisher, accord to this and this announcement. In my opinion, there's no need to change to was, since the game is not removed from steam, just taken down to move the data from old publisher to the new one. Rikka Takanashi (talk) • (contributions) 16:19, 19 August 2016 (PDT)

This item will probably be discontinued soon.

AVA is shutting down on june 29th this year, and the achivement you need to get this item is probably going to unobtainable. Well, maybe outside of something like SAM? We will probably have to change the availability to expired after that date. Graysocks (talk) 07:33, 7 May 2018 (UTC)

Well... yeah... obviously .-. Faghetti V.2 (talk) 08:11, 7 May 2018 (UTC)

Is the Black Rose going to be tradable or craftable ?

After AVA has been shut down, the Black Rose became unobtainable. The only way to get it is now steam market or backpack.tf. So... What is going to happen now ? User:CubeX (talk) 15:34 January 27 2019 (UTC)

First of all, I edited the talk to remove the part that should not be here and fix some wording. Secondly, this is official Team Fortress 2 Wiki that managed by community, not Valve. This question is belonging to either Team Fortress 2 Steam Discussion or directly asking this to Valve via E-mail instead. Rikka Takanashi (talk) • (contributions) 00:33, 28 January 2019 (UTC)

Hi, CubeX.

Hinaomi's answer is probably all you're going to get. We have no information regarding any item changes, the best you can do is starting a discussion on the Steam Community Hub or emailing Valve directly. I personally doubt that Valve would update this item to be craftable/tradeable as it is a promotional item. — Tark lm(pt-br) 00:16, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Evidence of craftable Black Rose bug

This video shows someone crafting the Black Rose. Sausagea1000 (talk) 13:37, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

Could you point to the specific part it's crafted? I took a quick look through it and couldn't find it, just someone trying to craft it.
GrampaSwood (talk) 13:53, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

The video is also 5 years old. I could find discussion threads talking about how some people have managed to craft this item at one point, but also many mentions of this bug being fixed not long after it was found. The way you formulated your sentence suggests that the weapon can still be crafted to this day, which is almost certainly not the case.
Seederat (talk) 14:47, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

Love when people don't even watch what is going on on the video. Like 5-6 years ago Valve accidently allowed to craft Poker promo items for a few hours, so who knew it started crafting them with tokens. This video was already posted after the patch and there's not a single Black Rose craft on it. Currently there no bug(s) that allow to craft Poker promo items. Denied (Talk) 15:42, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

The preceding discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it.