Talk:Item sets
Contents
- 1 Inadequate Sniper Quote
- 2 Editing the item set boxes
- 3 Should most of this be split into 5 separate pack pages?
- 4 A question
- 5 Bonus colors
- 6 Cost to craft all set hats
- 7 Bugs
- 8 Little trivia bit.
- 9 Item Set Threads?
- 10 The Hibernating Bear damage reduction
- 11 Croc-O-Style Kit Headshot 'Bug'
- 12 Because I foresee the whole Targe + Item Set thing coming up again...
- 13 Item Set Stratergy
- 14 Item Sets Vs. Themed Sets
- 15 Divided
- 16 Uber udates pictures
- 17 The Bison and the Cow Mangler...
- 18 Pictures
- 19 Anchor links
- 20 Class Update Sets
- 21 Sniper Halloween Set description: has it actually been confirmed?
- 22 Halloween Sets: add to the strategy pages?
- 23 Splitting: once again
- 24 Split
- 25 Update Brainiac Set Picture
- 26 Just Nocturne Being Negative
- 27 Eliminating the impossible
- 28 What does "Reduces mystery solving time by up to 88% " do?
- 29 Gameplay affecting sets
- 30 Weapon descriptions on each set page
- 31 Crafting Recipes on each set page.
Inadequate Sniper Quote
T.E. Lawrence had nothing to do with bargains. I think the sniper primary is only known as that because bazaar conveys an Arabic sense. What's with the bargain quote?Fyahweather 17:16, 22 June 2011 (PDT)
Editing the item set boxes
The Berliner's Bucket Helm is missing from the medic set. How could you fix this? Justin61295 16:15, 1 February 2011 (UTC)
- None of the Australian Christmas sets actually recquire the hat to be worn. Cooper Kid 17:56, 3 April 2011 (UTC)
Should most of this be split into 5 separate pack pages?
Item sets seems like a category, and each set (with its unique function and trivia and so forth) seems like it would make a fine short article.
Imagine someone looking in-game. They see a "Croc-o-style Set" weapon on a friend and go to TF2Wiki to find out about it. Will they find a page for it, or a bunch of search options including vague suggestions like "item sets" and "polycount pack?"
I suggest The Tank Buster, The Special Delivery, The Gas Jockey's Gear, The Croco-o-style Kit and The Saharan Spy become articles. This page can then be reduced down, kinda like the generic hat or weapon pages. :)
Zoolooman 18:54, 1 October 2010 (UTC)
- What we can do, is set up a redirect, such that a search for "Tank Buster" will link them to the specific section of this page. There really isn't enough information for each article to be worth creating --Firestorm 18:58, 1 October 2010 (UTC)
- I think that in time if and or when they implement new item sets for every class and maybe double for each class there could be a page specific for the sniper's or heavy's item sets. - Meter1060 18:47, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
A question
Do we really need to put the effects of each weapon along with the pictures? I think it would look better if we just left those out, as it is rather incomplete at the moment. Just my two cents worth, I guess. Randomscripter 21:36, 1 October 2010 (UTC)
- My first idea was to give a nice summary but the page really got big... maybe remove the bonus would be nice and placing them in the pages like the comment from Zoolooman
Chacal 02:27, 3 October 2010 (UTC)
Bonus colors
Is there a way to set color bonus like the items (blue for good stuff, red for bad)?
- I attempted to however I don't know how to edit the information in the boxes.--Jordan 12:59, 11 October 2010 (UTC)
Cost to craft all set hats
- 2 weapons = 1 scrap
- 3 scrap = 1 reclaimed
- 3 reclaimed = 1 refined
- 4 refined + weapon = set hat
- 16 refined = all 4 set hats
- 1 refined = 54 weapons
- 16 refined = 864 weapons
Shouldn't this be mentioned?
Layzergun 23:34, 7 November 2010 (UTC)
- I'm gonna say no, not useful in any way. Moussekateer 23:36, 7 November 2010 (UTC)
- Absolutely not. ~
lhavelund
(talk ▪ contrib) 23:37, 7 November 2010 (UTC) - I would say no. Also, there are 5 set hats. Lemon 23:38, 7 November 2010 (UTC)
- Oops, forgot the fez. :P
- All 5 set hats = 1080 weapons.
Now that I think about it, most likely there are going to be more set hats, so that info is pretty much useless... It's like reporting how much metal it would take to craft all the hats/weapons. Layzergun 11:52, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
- Could be used as trivia. - Meter1060 18:46, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
I agree that is pretty good trivia.--Magnum Force-Enforcer 14:10, 22 March 2012 (PDT)
Bugs
Ever since I added the Bugs section, I've been wanting to test out what could potentially be a bug with the Tank Buster set but do not have the resources to test it myself. The set grants a sentry resistance, what I wanted to test was if the rockets from the Level 3 sentry are affected by said resistance. The reasoning why I believe this may be a bug is because Wrangling a Level 3 sentry and killing someone with the rockets will give a non-wrangler kill icon so it may carry over. Hell, the Wrangler itself might be bugged with the set bonus, so those are a few things that I think are worth testing out. Psychopath 20:10, 13 November 2010 (UTC)
- I think one of your bugs isn't really a bug. The demoman's set might purposely give 55% instead of 60% because of how the game calculates the resistances. If it works the way it did in Kingdom Hearts 2, then it'd calculate the largest bonus first, which would be the Targe's 50% fire resistance. Then, it would calculate the set bonus' 10% from the remaining 50%, resulting in 5% being added to the total resistances. The result is a correct, if unexpected, 55% resistance. If there's other stacking resistances, could somebody please check this? If there's no other stacking ones then I feel it should be removed until we can prove it's a bug. Terrankazuma 09:10, 1 January 2011 (UTC)
- You can check this by using the Rocket/Sticky Jumper with the Pain Train. Using the calculation system above, you should take 220% from bullet damage (making -120% bullet resistance). I can't test it myself because I don't have the items. Enigma314 02:32, 3 January 2011 (UTC)
- It's calculated multiplicitavely in terms of damage taken; 50% * 90% = 45%. Also see this similar discussion. Toomai Glittershine 03:35, 6 February 2011 (UTC)
Shouldn't the second statement read; "Snipers who have the entire Croc-O-Style Kit equipped can still die BY headshots", not; "Snipers who have the entire Croc-O-Style Kit equipped can still die to headshots."--MEDUNN 13:27, 1 March 2011 (UTC)
Little trivia bit.
I've added a little trivia section at the end. What I put about the engineer may be not true in a later update, but for now it's safe to say, and a point worth making. Smashbrother101 22:29, 18 December 2010 (UTC)
Item Set Threads?
Seeing how most if not all of the item sets have threads made by the their creators, I was wondering if we could add links on the bottom of the item sets to the threads showing the progress made by the creators. This is a Signature 18:27, 7 January 2011 (UTC)
The Hibernating Bear damage reduction
I just have to ask. If a critical rocket is shot at the heavy with the hibernating bear set how much damage will be reduced from that rocket? Around around 13.5? If so what about a mini-crit rocket? Zelaroth 18:49, 29 January 2011 (UTC)
Croc-O-Style Kit Headshot 'Bug'
I'm not exactly sure that this is considered a bug, but more Trivia:
Snipers who have the entire Croc-O-Style Kit equipped can still die to headshots if they have around 1 health point. This is either a bug, or a misconception caused by the set bonus description.
It's kind of a herp derp because you're technically saying that you should be invincible to headshots. Theres a reason that you can survive one headshot, but you can't survive two. Any player could pick up on the fact that they LOSE HEALTH when headshotted. — The preceding unsigned comment was added by Bigboomar (talk) • (contribs) 23:04, 5 February 2001 (EST)
- The description says "The wearer cannot be killed by headshots." This implies that "no matter how much damage is taken in any number of hits, if it's a headshot, the user will not die". Because this is apparently not true in 100% of cases like the description implies, it's either a bug (with the coding) or an error (with the description).
- Personally, I think it's a bug. HP is tracked as real numbers (things like the Degreaser's afterburn prove this), so if you have less than 1HP, you can't have your health reduced to 1HP (because you're already below that), so it's reduced to 0. Toomai Glittershine 15:16, 6 February 2011 (UTC)
- I'm sure anyone with a tinge of common sense will muster that you aren't invincible to damage so long as it is a headshot. It's no ubercharge. That's why I am saying It is not so much a bug, but more trivia that Valve incorrectly described it.
Because I foresee the whole Targe + Item Set thing coming up again...
Don't question why, especially since it says so on the loadout screen, but a few of us went off and got mathematical proof of the 55% fire damage reduction. Tournament rulesets were on, which meant damage spread was off.
Because of the way afterburn deals damage, testing with it gets some funky numbers (from 102 to 55 to 34-ish damage) when going from Vanilla -> Targe only -> Targe + Set. Good thing the Flare Gun's projectile counts as fire damage.
The Flare Gun's projectile deals a set 30 damage. It also deals 90 damage on a long-range crit. So...
Vanilla Demoman -> 90 damage (100%).
Chargin' Targe -> 45 damage (50%).
Chargin' Targe + Item Set -> 41 damage. (~55%, and certainly not 60%). There.
Fine, fine, question me why. There was a fun hour of dispute over it, so that's why we went off and did this.
-- InShane 05:24, 6 February 2011 (UTC)
- The mechanics behind damage modification are already well known. The 55% was never a mystery.--
Mechlord 05:28, 6 February 2011 (UTC)
Item Set Stratergy
Do you think we should have a section or link to item set strategy?--MEDUNN 13:29, 1 March 2011 (UTC)
- Nope. We already have information about strategies with sets in Community strategies pages and in basic strategies pages. Rins
(talk | contribs) 19:50, 4 March 2011 (UTC)
Item Sets Vs. Themed Sets
Considering that these may be completely different, here is my proposal:
- We split the article into two sections: "Sets with bonuses" and "Themed sets" With the former providing the set bonuses, and the latter simply being items that are tied to a certain theme, such as the new Mobster items.
Please discuss this here, as well as providing better names for the two sections than I have come up with -- Firestorm 15:13, 21 June 2011 (UTC)
- A major problem I see with that, is that the term "themed sets" is so broad, certain things like collections of promo items, could, in theory, qualify for that. I'm thinking like the Witcher stuff for Scout. You probably know how I feel on this issue, but to re-iterate on the talk page, I feel that in TF2, the term "set" has a very specific meaning, referring to only groups of items with stats for wearing them together. Showing other groups of items on this page has the potential to mislead readers into thinking certain groups of items have set bonuses, when they do not. Balladofwindfishes 15:16, 21 June 2011 (UTC)
- Maybe we should hang up this discussion until the update's out and we can confirm whether or not the new sets have additional stats when worn together? -- Cooper Kid (Blether · Contreebs) 21:23, 21 June 2011 (UTC)
- Based on Day 3 of the Uber Update, these items are referred to Class Packs: "Presenting not one, not three, but two soldier class packs!" – Jmudge 18:05, 22 June 2011 (PDT)
- I agree. If these packs don't have actual set bonuses, they shouldn't be on this page. Dragonsbrethren 03:28, 23 June 2011 (PDT)
- Well, whaddaya know - they're all item sets after all! --Cooper Kid (Blether · Contreebs) 19:39, 23 June 2011 (PDT)
- Maybe we should hang up this discussion until the update's out and we can confirm whether or not the new sets have additional stats when worn together? -- Cooper Kid (Blether · Contreebs) 21:23, 21 June 2011 (UTC)
So do they have actual effects or not?— The preceding unsigned comment was added by Powmonkey (talk) • (contribs)
Divided
Anyone else think the page needs to be divided by class rather than update? -- Pilk (talk) 22:09, 22 June 2011 (PDT)
- I agree. There's really no need to sort by update when the sets are already mentioned on the updates' pages. Dragonsbrethren 03:30, 23 June 2011 (PDT)
- I'm in agreement. Dividing it by class seems logical, as well as it would probably make things a bit cleaner. Anubis 03:59, 23 June 2011 (PDT)
- Done. Murphly 11:38, 26 June 2011 (PDT)
Uber udates pictures
I was thinking, for the pictures of for the uber update packs, we should use (or copy) the ones they used on the update pages, the medic one looks really good anyway.Ihasnotomato
The Bison and the Cow Mangler...
not sure how to describe those... I'll leave it to someone else. GreenEarth28 09:52, 21 July 2011 (PDT)
Pictures
I think it'd be better if the pictures displayed every item in the set, even if the class doesn't actually appear that way in-game. On the Polycount update page, the Scout held both the Milk and Fish, with the Shortstop at his waist and the hat on his head. This allowed us to see all four items in the set at once. I think that every picture on this page should be remade in that style. They should also be full body, head to toe, if only for the sake of the set with the Mantreads. What do you guys think? --SilverHammer 10:57, 21 July 2011 (PDT)
- I think that that would be a great idea to implement. I would make some of the images myself, but I have no idea how... Anzallos 22:32, 21 July 2011 (PDT)
- It wouldn't only be for the sake of the Mantreads. You're obviously forgetting about the Booties on my beloved Demoknight. Thenyproject 22:34, 21 July 2011 (PDT)
Support Great idea. Might be able to do it in Garry's Mod. I'll maybe have a go myself if I have time tonight and see what you think. » Cooper Kid (Blether · Contreebs) 05:20, 22 July 2011 (PDT)
Anchor links
Anchor links from nav boxes seem to be broken. In the Über Update nav box, for example, the anchor links are all numbered, not named. Looking at the markup, I can tell that a lot of it is in there to preserve multilanguage interoperability. However, in the article itself, it doesn't look like these anchors are defined anywhere. I'm going to go through and add an additional numbered anchor to preserve the nav box anchor links. If someone has a better way of fixing this, please let me know. coreycubed / talk 06:46, 22 July 2011 (PDT)
Class Update Sets
I figured this would be the best palce to put this. Since some of the class weapons released as stand-alone updates work so well together (ex. Engineer Update, Scout update, etc.) Should we make set strategies for them on the Basic/Community strategy pages? For updates that gave 2 weps to a slot (Demo, Sniper, Spy) we can't but for the other six, why not? Whatcha think? ShadowGlove 16:35, 10 September 2011 (PDT)
- No. They were not meant to be used together, unlike other sets. – Epic Eric (T | C) 16:37, 10 September 2011 (PDT)
Sniper Halloween Set description: has it actually been confirmed?
None of my friends have reported anything happening when headshotting someone while wearing the full set. Honestly? Someone probably headshot an enemy using the Bombinomicon and thought it was a set bonus. -- Henry Spencer 18:39, 31 October 2011 (PDT)
- I'm not sure either. I do have 2 complete sets of the Halloween costumes (one set in Unique quality, the other in Haunted quality), so I'll run some tests on my idle server when I get home from work. 404: User Not Found (talk) 19:24, 31 October 2011 (PDT)
- It was a mistaken edit by someone, which was reverted but the cache hasn't caught up yet. —
Moussekateer·talk 19:26, 31 October 2011 (PDT)
- Oh. Well I still find it odd that the Soldier, Demoman and Engineer sets all have special effects, but none of the other sets do. Isn't there a .RES file or some sort of file in one of the GCF files that shows info on the bonuses given by wearing a set? I coulda swore there was something similar in items_game.txt....or maybe there's some text lines in tf_english.txt that are labelled as set bonuses for the costumes?... 404: User Not Found (talk) 19:40, 31 October 2011 (PDT)
- It was a mistaken edit by someone, which was reverted but the cache hasn't caught up yet. —
- I was on a server where headshots were causing head explosions. Either a mod turns it on or a mod turns it off, I couldn't tell because the server dumped me due to a bad map before I could test it. — The preceding unsigned comment was added by Cartigan (talk) • (contribs) 20:53, 6 November 2011
Halloween Sets: add to the strategy pages?
I recently added the Halloween item sets to each classes basic, community and anti strategy page but they have since been removed. Due to the Item sets section on those pages being changed to Item Set Effects, I can understand that a majority would not fit but wouldn't the Soldier, Demoman and Engineer sets still belong due to the bonuses, even if they don't effect game play. - Encouragement Pyro November 2, 2011 15:06 (EST)
- You have just answered yourself: they do not effect game play, so they aren't notable for Strategy articles. – Epic Eric (T | C) 12:12, 2 November 2011 (PDT)
- The thing is though, Since the sets change voice pitch for the engy, the responses for the Soldier, and allow the Demo to howl, Wouldn't those be considered in anti class strategies as nods to there presence. That's how I was thinking about it. Encouragement Pyro 12:18, 2 November 2011 (PDT)
- I really don't see how those different responses affect gameplay in any way. They're only played at moments when you'd normally hear a response anyway. » Cooper Kid (blether) • (contreebs) 16:39, 2 November 2011 (PDT)
- The thing is though, Since the sets change voice pitch for the engy, the responses for the Soldier, and allow the Demo to howl, Wouldn't those be considered in anti class strategies as nods to there presence. That's how I was thinking about it. Encouragement Pyro 12:18, 2 November 2011 (PDT)
Update Brainiac Set Picture
As of the Feb. 10th update, the Brainiac Headpiece no longer hides Engineer's default helmet. This would need to be reflected in the image next to the Dr. Grordbort's Brainiac Pack. General Veers 09:59, 27 February 2012 (PST)
Just Nocturne Being Negative
I couldn't help but notice, but the "Cynical Trial" Medic set uses the picture from the Meet the Medic introductory page, (At this link, [1]) and none of the other full set pictures use the pictures from the set pages. It just looks sort of odd being different and all. If I find time I'll try to take a new one myself, but if anyone can or has that would be appreciated. It just sticks out and bugs me. Thanks for listening to my rant, Nocturne 21:52, 27 February 2012 (PST)
- I agree. The quality of the picture is different when compared to the rest, and bugs me. It's not consistent and probably will be the only set that can be fully depicted by a clip from a "Meet the Team" video (unless something from "Meet the Pyro" comes out). But I think it's best to wait to see what some others have to say, given the picture does show the set accurately.General Veers 05:51, 28 February 2012 (PST)
It ticks me off to so yeah I'll say too that we have to change the picture.--Magnum Force-Enforcer 16:57, 28 March 2012 (PDT)
Eliminating the impossible
As far as I can tell this set is hidden in each items description until you equip them both. Not sure where to put this factoid and where to not the "effect" is just a funny line. - Devozade 16:24, 8 March 2012 (PST)
What does "Reduces mystery solving time by up to 88% " do?
What does "Reduces mystery solving time by up to 88% " do? If it does nothing can we put "the effect does noting" somewhere?
Isn't "Reduces mystery solving time by up to 88% " the mystery part that is solved which is a hidden effect? --Bigbangbilly!!! 18:16, 8 March 2012 (PST)
- I suspect it is a joke inserted by Valve. If I'm not mistaken, that is how it is described in the item schema. Perhaps if would be necessary to add a footnote saying that it does nothing for overall gameplay. Upgrade 18:21, 8 March 2012 (PST)
- So it does nothing? Not even anything aesthetically? maggosh 18:23, 8 March 2012 (PST)
- It's another joke, like item descriptions and names, it does absolutely nothing except display as a positive (blue) attribute. - Devozade 18:25, 8 March 2012 (PST)
- Well, the following is just pure speculation, so don't bother adding it to the article or I'll remove it. I think it's a joke that there are 9 classes (Nine-Pipe Problem) and one of them is guilty of... something. Well, 88% is 8/9 (rounding fail), so maybe the Medic discards 8 suspects and ends up finding out who did whatever it was. However, that's only a possibility. But actually, this text doesn't do anything special, nor does it affect gameplay. – Epic Eric (T | C) 13:39, 9 March 2012 (PST)
- It's another joke, like item descriptions and names, it does absolutely nothing except display as a positive (blue) attribute. - Devozade 18:25, 8 March 2012 (PST)
Gameplay affecting sets
If we all agree that it would be better to make separate articles, I would like to propose an alternative for the new articles looks, for exemple the Saharan Spy.(not finished [yet])
- That's similar to proposal 1 on the discussion above, and I think that one's more concise. (Next time, it's better if you put multiple-section proposals on your user page so it doesn't fiddle with the number of topics here.) Tabs 02:45, 31 March 2012 (PDT)
On dear, my apologises, I did not think of putting it on my own page, and I had no idea it would be split into several topics.
I agree with your opinion about the speacial delivery and the opinion about it being similar to porposal 1, but it is not the same. I believe should be a page for each Gameplay-affecting set, and a separate article for each classes non affecting sets. Don't you agree? And by the way, should I delete all of the topics I accidentally added?
Sincerely yours, AlonBru 10:52, 31 March 2012 (PDT)
Weapon descriptions on each set page
Note that weapon descriptions on set pages are identical to the weapon descriptions on class pages. Currently almost all those descriptions are located in language-independent templates. It would be nice to somehow reuse this data. Look at Special Delivery, what do you think? — Stormbird T│C 09:18, 13 April 2012 (PDT)
- So, you do really think, that creating a template for each weapon, then creating a template to unite them into a set list, and then post it on each set's page is really worth simple weapon description? It's kinda... Well. Isn't Wiki grid enough? Limie Pie
09:27, 13 April 2012 (PDT)
- I think that having information duplicated on different pages is... just bad. My experience tells me this. One day the information in one place will be changed, updated or corrected, and in another place will remain outdated. Not even speaking about pages in other languages. And the way I suggest it, you make the change once, and have it reflected in all dependent places, including translations. Yes, it requires some efforts in the beginning. Once. After that, you only have profit :). —
Stormbird T│C 09:37, 13 April 2012 (PDT)
- I think that having information duplicated on different pages is... just bad. My experience tells me this. One day the information in one place will be changed, updated or corrected, and in another place will remain outdated. Not even speaking about pages in other languages. And the way I suggest it, you make the change once, and have it reflected in all dependent places, including translations. Yes, it requires some efforts in the beginning. Once. After that, you only have profit :). —
- incorrectly designed template. need all of these templates in a collect. simple copy does not make sense and time--FreeXMan Talk | Cont 09:50, 13 April 2012 (PDT)
Crafting Recipes on each set page.
Now that we have more space to dedicate for each set, we can take advantage of it and put some more information.
I thought it would be more comfort that if someone is looking at sets, he likes the set and now he asks himself "how do I get those items?" and that page doesn't provide the answer, which means we did not edited our page the right way.
I want to provide an answer, on each page we should put the recipes of how to obtain each item. Atlas 10:04, 14 April 2012 (PDT)
Disagree Those are specific to each item. Plus, the main item sets page already says this (All set headwear and misc. items can be crafted using four Refined Metal and a weapon from the set the desired headwear/misc. that the item belongs to (For example, 4 Refined Metal and a Soda Popper would make a Bonk Boy).) – Epic Eric (T | C) 12:35, 14 April 2012 (PDT)
Agree Doesn't matter what this page says anymore, the set pages are their own unique pages now and this information is related to those pages. Balladofwindfishes 17:43, 16 April 2012 (PDT)
- Just as an example, here's what would need to be displayed on the Croc-o-Style page:
Huntsman | Reclaimed Metal | Sydney Sleeper | ||
![]() |
+ | ![]() |
= | ![]() |
Class Token - Sniper | Slot Token - Primary | Scrap Metal | Possible Results | |||||||||||||||||||
![]() |
+ | ![]() |
+ | ![]() |
= |
|
Razorback | Reclaimed Metal | Darwin's Danger Shield | ||
![]() |
+ | ![]() |
= | ![]() |
Class Token - Sniper | Slot Token - Secondary | Scrap Metal | Possible Results | |||||||||||||||||||
![]() |
+ | ![]() |
+ | ![]() |
= |
|
Eyelander | Reclaimed Metal | Bushwacka | ||
![]() |
+ | ![]() |
= | ![]() |
Class Token - Sniper | Slot Token - Melee | Scrap Metal | Possible Results | |||||||||||||||||||
![]() |
+ | ![]() |
+ | ![]() |
= |
|
Refined Metal | Croc-o-Style Kit weapon | Ol' Snaggletooth | ||
![]() |
+ | ![]() ![]() ![]() |
= | ![]() |
- That's an awful lot of tables to throw into one section - and that's not even including the other crafting recipes those weapons are used in. » Cooper Kid (blether) • (contreebs) 17:51, 16 April 2012 (PDT)
- Oh, I was just thinking the 4 refined + weapon recipes should be on the page, since those are set related. The specific recipes for the weapons are not related to the set as a whole and should not be there. Balladofwindfishes 17:57, 16 April 2012 (PDT)