User talk:BrazilianNut/Sandbox/List of Underworlds

Collaboration chat

I have taken the liberty of moving the discussion from the Sandbox/List of Underworlds to the Talk space. This way, we Talk here, and work on the table as it would appear in the Main space. Revert if I am out of line. M I K A D O 282 🎃🎃🎃🎃🎃🎃 🎃🎃 🎃🎃 (talk) (To Do) 01:43, 7 November 2018 (UTC)

@Mikado282 What is it you wanted to do? I'm sorry, I didn't understand your comment on Talk:Underworld. :B

@BrazilianNut Yes. If you want, go ahead and copy the table so far here, then people can help here and talk about it here.

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@Mikado282

I was just looking at the Halloween maps page, and I noticed something: all but the first and last columns of the table listing the maps have more than a single purpose.

• First is the map itself and its regular version (if any).
• Second is both the game mode and the map's file's name.
• Third is date and event the map was added in.
• Fourth is spawns, features, and hazards.

I believe we could do the same with the table for listing Underworlds:

• Map and Underworld (we could do like on the Halloween maps page, with the Underworld above and its map below in parenthesis)
• Hazards and Magic spells (could be under "Contents" together with things like Pumkpkin Bombs and Health Kits)

While looking how the table would look like with a column for both Entry and Entry Buffs and another for Exit and Exit Buffs, I found it was ugly, so I preferred to keep them separate.

User talk:BrazilianNut/Sandbox/List of Underworlds It would probably look something like this:

	Underworld (Map)	Entry	Entry buffs	Contents	Exit	Exit buffs
	Purgatory (Eyeaduct)	MONOCULUS portals, Humiliation	Full heal	Health drain, Stygian water, Health kits (6 medium)	White portal	Overheal, Invulnerability, Crit boost, Speed boost

- BrazilianNut (talk) 23:26, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

(== Underworld intro ==)

How about this for an intro:

Underworld is the general name used to refer to alternate play areas present in certain Halloween maps. They were introduced in the Very Scary Halloween Special update with the map Eyeaduct.

Although Underworlds differ from each other depending on their map, they feature many common characteristics.

• They are scary, supernatural locations set in different realities, often referred to as damnation places.
• Access to them is open for short periods, either through portals that only appear every so often or at the very end of the round.
• Play time on them is limited, either by a health drain that increases over time or by the place exploding after a while.
• Lethal hazards that instantaneously kill players surround the place, severely limiting the playable area.
  • Together with the aforementioned limited play time, it makes them much more linear than the regular part of their maps.
• Rewards such as Rare Magic Spells and buffs when exiting (like invincibility and guaranteed crits) encourage players to use these areas to try and gain a tactical advantage in the main map.
• Engineers can't build on them.
• Players are encouraged to try these locations out through Achievements, Achievement items, and Halloween Contract Objectives.

As you can guess, my intention is to remove the General features section and incorporate it into the intro. Also, if we're making that Underworlds table, then the long-named "List of maps with Underworld locations" could go bye-bye as well. Lastly, I think a "Underworld-like areas" section featuring Ghost Fort's Skull Island, Probed's flying saucer interior, and (maybe) Monster Bash's pendulums corridor would be a good addition to the page.

- BrazilianNut (talk) 01:03, 7 November 2018 (UTC)

"my intention is to remove the General features section and incorporate it into the intro."

K

"Also, if we're making that Underworlds table, then the long-named "List of maps with Underworld locations" could go bye-bye as well."

Sure, my intent was one or the other.

"Ghost Fort's Skull Island"

Skull Island is traditionally an Underworld in this wiki, unless I am mistaken. IMO, it only adds awkwardness to treat it otherwise.

"Probed's flying saucer interior"

An odd case, a "See also" for now.

"Monster Bash's pendulums corridor "

The Pit and Pendulums is an Underworld.

M I K A D O 282 🎃🎃🎃🎃🎃🎃 🎃🎃 🎃🎃 (talk) (To Do) 01:43, 7 November 2018 (UTC)

IMO, the only reason that you do not consider Pit and Pendulums to be an Underworld is the proximity of the entry spawn to the bottom of the pit.

IMO< the only reason that the Pit and Pendulums entry spawn has proximity to the bottom of the pit is to make the visual pun, visible only in noclip. From the perspective of the players, there is some suggestion that the fall ends in the summoning circle (but the player's momentum is conserved as it is in most other underworld portals), IMO not enough reason to not group it with the other Underworld.

M I K A D O 282 🎃🎃🎃🎃🎃🎃 🎃🎃 🎃🎃 (talk) (To Do) 02:16, 7 November 2018 (UTC)

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I do not consider Pit and Pendulums an Underworld simply because it seems more like just a hidden area of the castle rather than some evil dimension. Same with Ghost Fort's Skull Island - you can see it from the main portion of the map, it is not hidden from view and it's not in a different plane of existence like all other Underworlds. Also, we have no evidence that all of Ghost Fort is an Underworld, that is just speculation.

I would like to point out, though, that I've added both to the table, as well as Helltower's Skull Island. - BrazilianNut (talk) 16:12, 7 November 2018 (UTC)

Notes about the table

• I feel like having "Achievement(s)" along with "Achievement item" would be redundant, since "Achievement item" implies the player will receive the item together with an achievement.
• The Carnival of Carnage Underworlds do not have "Achievement items" listed in the Contents column simply because neither the Necro Smasher nor the Halloween Gift Cauldron are exclusive to any of them.
  • The Necro Smasher can even be obtained in the main map if the fourth Merasmachievement the player unlocks is Arms Reduction.
• Falling Platforms is a bit hard to determine if it should even have "Achievement" at all, as it is the only mini-game that does not have an exclusive achievement and all the Merasmachievements that can be obtained there can be obtained elsewhere.

- BrazilianNut (talk) 16:12, 7 November 2018 (UTC)

So, I see that you've fleshed out the table. All I have at the moment is my phone and 15 more minutes, so, I'll have to review tonight. Or tomorrow. I was to see earlier that you had caught that one way to get to the underworld is humiliation. M I K A D O 282 🎃🎃🎃🎃🎃🎃 🎃🎃 🎃🎃 (talk) (To Do) 19:18, 7 November 2018 (UTC)

About the Revert

@BrazilianNut: First, I greatly appreciate both the effort you have put into the table, and your willingness to tolerate my whims. However, the table is not finished enough to publish. Know also, that there is some disagreement (not yet expressed within the discussion) as to the structure of the main Underworld article. Please be patient with my limited pace of contribution. I find the table personally very useful, as is, even if it is not completed to the style of the wiki, even it takes days, weeks or longer, IMO, the analysis has already contributed to the quality of my edits to the Halloween map articles. M I K A D O 282 🎃🎃🎃🎃🎃🎃 🎃🎃 🎃🎃 (talk) (To Do) 12:53, 8 November 2018 (UTC) 14:47, 8 November 2018 (UTC)

Status

I want to work more on this table. Also, the Underworld page needs more attention, I think. I really do not have the time to work on this at this time, but I will get back to this. There is some unpublished disagreement about the topic. I want to make a comparison of all the Underworlds for my own interest, (are "types", or is each Underworld unique in its mechanics?), but it will have to wait. M I K A D O 🦃🦃🦃🦃🦃🦃 🦃🦃 🦃🦃 (talk) (To Do) 15:42, 22 November 2018 (UTC)