Team Fortress Wiki:Discussion

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Adding alt text to images

There doesn't seem to be a consistent method of adding alt text to pictures found in articles, which is a major accessibility barrier. It would be great if this could be managed somehow. Crabguy (talk) 20:20, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

So for images using [[File:]], the alt parameter should work fine. Images in the <gallery> tag can also use the |alt=, but it should be between the description text and the filename such as

File:Scout.png|The Scout from Team Fortress 2|The Scout. As for any templates, a separate parameter would have to be added.
GrampaSwood (talk) 20:37, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

While we appreciate the initiative, adding alt texts manually to images would be an awful lot of work for something that won't hold that much value to us.

In terms of accessibility for screen readers, articles generally are well-written and tend to go in-depth about its content. In some cases, image thumbnails have visible text which describe the image.

Unfortunately, we've had users in the past that wanted to take on big tasks like this one, only to never fully go through with them, which left some inconsistencies or had us clean up after them, so we're sometimes skeptical on the delivery.

If you still believe that this is needed, we could add automatic support for it through the necessary templates, in the same way that Wikipedia does; however, galleries and such would need to be done manually. — Wookipan (talk | contribs) 22:04, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

Staff emergency meeting

Staff emergency meeting. — Tark 14:16, 10 October 2022 (UTC)

Adding a notice to Talk pages

Denied has recently made a suggestion that I agree with. In their words: "Every talk page needs some edit note like THIS IS NOT A PLACE FOR DISCUSSIONS OUTSIDE OF THE ITEM ITSELF. FOR COMMUNITY DISCUSSIONS GO TO THE STEAM FORUMS."

While not necessarily with those words or formatting, I do believe adding such a notice could discourage new contributors from adding topics, sometimes creating entirely new talk pages in the process, with questions like "how do i shot bullet?" or statements such as "pootis man is funny" while teaching them the proper place for them. - BrazilianNut (talk) 16:58, 1 September 2022 (UTC)

I'm neutral on this, I'll support it but I also think it's not too large of an issue currently. Also try avoiding using {{Quotation}} on talk pages as it breaks them.
GrampaSwood (talk) 17:03, 1 September 2022 (UTC)

I think the more common misuse of talk pages is to use the talk page for talking about the page's subject, but they can both be encompassed in one message. BrazilianNut, are you picturing something like this being on MediaWiki:Newarticletext? Naleksuh (talk) 20:20, 1 September 2022 (UTC)

No, I'm not, Naleksuh, and that's the misuse I was trying to say, but I admit I failed to convey that thanks to bad examples and maybe some poor wording. - BrazilianNut (talk) 22:20, 1 September 2022 (UTC)

If you didn't mean that, then what did you mean? I was hoping you would elaborate rather than simply saying no. Naleksuh (talk) 06:24, 2 September 2022 (UTC)

An editnotice similar to Brain Bucket or Chicken Kiev is what I imagine he means, but on every page starting with Talk:.
GrampaSwood (talk) 10:57, 2 September 2022 (UTC)

What GrampaSwood said; I meant a red edit notice, like the ones for those two articles, at the start of Talk pages telling contributors that a Talk page is for discussing the article itself, not for asking questions or making comments about the article's subject (like using a weapon's Talk page to ask how to best utilize it or to comment how they think it should be buffed/nerfed), and that they should use the Steam Forums for such things (maybe providing a link as well).

Apologies for any confusion caused by bad examples or by making my messages too short. - BrazilianNut (talk) 12:17, 2 September 2022 (UTC)

That's a tough nut. It might help to tokenize the page titles in the tag, somehow. "This <item's> Discussions are for talking about issues within the <item's> page, not for talking about the <item>." That is not easy to pose or parse. Imagine the translators. You may have mentioned this, but if you go with the tag, it should clearly state to the reader that it has a link to the full explanation of the policy.

M I K A D O 282 ⊙⊙⊙⊙⊙⊙ ⊙⊙ ⊙⊙ (Contact Mikado282 (SM)) | (contribs) (Help Wanted!) 13:20, 2 September 2022 (UTC)

 Nope. It's possible, but the amount of work involved in adding and maintaining it is far greater than simply reverting the edit and messaging the user. — Tark 21:26, 2 September 2022 (UTC)

Create an exception for an item link from the dictionary

Please read the discussion here.
Does anyone know how to create that kind of exception? Tiagoquix (talk) 19:41, 7 September 2022 (UTC)

Pages with the fewest revisions - redirects

Pages with the fewest revisions (long loading) -- there are many redirects here with names in other languages, such as Spanish and Russian. Are they OK to be in the Wiki or should they be deleted? Tiagoquix (talk) 02:18, 19 September 2022 (UTC)

Unless redirects are actively harmful, there is no reason to remove them.
GrampaSwood (talk) 09:39, 19 September 2022 (UTC)

Item schema updates with blog posts

How do we go about updates with blog posts but no actual updates? For example, TF2 was not updated on October 11th 2021 outside of an item schema update and a blog post, but October 11, 2021 Patch exists. Also the "Patch 2" for September 26, 2022 Patch even though I'm pretty sure patch 2 was item schema only. Do these count as updates? Should they at least be flagged? Naleksuh (talk) 03:04, 27 September 2022 (UTC)

Update: Eric Smith confirmed that there were really 2 patches today. Though the point remains about the first one. Naleksuh (talk) 04:48, 27 September 2022 (UTC)

They are Patches. Updates and Patches are synonymous. AFAIK, there was no Blog post for these Patches. What do you mean tagged?

M I K A D O 282 ⊙⊙⊙⊙⊙⊙ ⊙⊙ ⊙⊙ (Contact Mikado282 (SM)) | (contribs) (Help Wanted!) 00:37, 28 September 2022 (UTC)

I think you may have misunderstood me. I mean that there was a post announcing an update/patch but the game was not actually updated. What happened was an item schema update, and the change to Corpse Carriers was announced there. There was no hlds email, nor any update to install. Naleksuh (talk) 18:19, 28 September 2022 (UTC)

CSS pages deletion request

Since I can't mark them for deletion, could the TF Wiki's staff delete them for me? Thanks in advance.
User:Tiagoquix/common.css & User:Tiagoquix/vector.css Tiagoquix (talk) 22:51, 27 September 2022 (UTC)

I can delete most pages, but I can not delete or edit these. It has high protection that I can't touch.

M I K A D O 282 ⊙⊙⊙⊙⊙⊙ ⊙⊙ ⊙⊙ (Contact Mikado282 (SM)) | (contribs) (Help Wanted!) 00:55, 28 September 2022 (UTC)

 Done — Tark 11:42, 28 September 2022 (UTC)

Module:Availability

The winter2016 parameter links redirect to the wrong page. I also made a topic to add drop-expired. Could someone look at it? Thanks Mgpt (talk) 22:38, 8 October 2022 (UTC)

 Fixed. Thanks. — Tark 17:41, 10 October 2022 (UTC)

contributed-by auto update

Can we have some ways to auto update contributed-by for cosmetics for different languages? Lot of times only English get updated and updating all other languages is repetitive and exhausting. Hope there could be a contributed-by dictionary or a bot that auto sync this. --Alex┋T 22:54, 9 October 2022 (UTC)

It would be really helpful to have a dictionary for that, however updating the current pages would be very time consuming.

You can force WindBOT to recheck the page, and it should automatically sync the contributed-by parameter. Here is an example: 1) input, 2) result. — Tark 14:35, 10 October 2022 (UTC)

Hope it can be a scheduled work for all cosmetics page for the bot :/ something like every 2 weeks sync all contributed-by of recent added cosmetics, and every 6 month sync all contributed-by of all cosmetics. --Alex┋T 02:30, 11 October 2022 (UTC)

200k celebration

Hello everyone, this is a reminder to let you all know that we are fast approaching 200,000 registered users.
Last milestone which was 100K, happened back in 2019 (3 years ago), this is a good opportunity to give everyone a pat on the back for bringing the wiki to where it is today.
At the time of writing, we are at 199,535, we can positively estimate that we will reach 200K in the next few days or in the coming weeks.

Luno 🎃 16:53, 15 October 2022 (UTC)

Maybe we can do something different this time around. Instead of HLMV shots of people's loadouts, why not invite 32 players on an empty server and do screenshots there or something? I dunno. The only problem is that there would be a limit of 32 players. Last year, we had exactly 32 people on the group photo. - ▪ - 17:35, 15 October 2022 (UTC)

  I think that making some sort of celebration is a wonderful idea, I personally think that doing another HLMV shot is not a bad take. Moreover, one of the downsides of going to an empty server, is that not everyone shares the same time-zones, it could be difficult for everyone to join a server at the same time, in my opinion. Yossef • Talk 17:49, 15 October 2022 (UTC)

True, maybe someone who is good at SFM could do a SFM poster or something, for variety's sake. I'm not good with SFM. But, we can continue with the HLMV shot. We have more people working on images now, so each one can work on a few loadouts collaboratively. - ▪ - 17:59, 15 October 2022 (UTC)

If we can get a group photo with HLMV or SFM done, then maybe we could somehow get 3 celebrations throughout 3 different time zones so that everyone could celebrate on a server or something. It would need some planning obviously, but I think it could work.
Andrew360 18:08, 15 October 2022 (UTC)

I remember when 100K hit, I was personally not part of the celebration since I was not made aware it was happening, I'm very surprised to see how soon 200K was reached though.

Luno 🎃 18:16, 15 October 2022 (UTC)

Ooh, if we're doing another celebration, I definitely want to be a part of it. My loadout's a Wiki Cap, Cuban Bristle Crisis, and the Commissar's Coat, just like last time. I'd like to be holding either my Factory New Top Shelf Minigun or Golden Frying Pan. If we're doing a group shot in a server, I probably won't be around to be on it, but I'd try. — 08:41, 17 October 2022 (UTC)

I don't know how this was done last celebration, but I made a page for how we could organize HLMV image requests. The page is right here, pending means that the user hasn't approved their image yet in case they want a different pose or some small changes. Thoughts?
Andrew360 15:41, 17 October 2022 (UTC)

  I like that format, pretty intuitive and straightforward. Let us know when whoever wants to participates can fill the request table ♥. Yossef • Talk 19:27, 17 October 2022 (UTC)

Alright then, I made a new page where all the images and requests will be now. The page is right here, if any other image makers want to complete requests/add images to the image table then go ahead!
Andrew360 21:10, 17 October 2022 (UTC)

┌────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘ Not to be a party popper, but the majority of our registered users are spam bots. We are, however, approaching 70k articles, which is worth celebrating. — Tark 00:07, 18 October 2022 (UTC)

User:Tark Where do you get the number of spam bots from? If you can find it automatically, what are CheckUsers doing? Also, "not to be a party popper", but the majority of our articles are the same article over and over in other languages. So there aren't really anywhere near 70k articles. Naleksuh (talk) 00:16, 18 October 2022 (UTC)

And then like last time, Gabrielwoj will tell you that it's just for fun, bots are mostly part of TF2 culture anyways, and we could make the cheese wheel chart argument pointing out all the shy users/those that don't know what they're doing/one offs, on the other hand 100k articles sounds like a big celebration, its years off though it seems, but we're getting there.

Luno 🎃 00:20, 18 October 2022 (UTC)

Also, my own loadout image is reserved, I just haven't done yet (pls don't get from my userpage). Just letting image editors know. - ▪ - 00:57, 18 October 2022 (UTC)

Here is a list of newly-made accounts. They're mostly bots.
GrampaSwood (talk) 10:12, 18 October 2022 (UTC)

Also, information for image creators: We should use the default lightrot on all of these loadout pictures, so no picture looks too drastically different from the other, in terms of lighting. The default values for lightrot are (0.000000 180.000000 0.000000). - ▪ - 12:16, 18 October 2022 (UTC)

We hit 200k users (and bots), by the way. - ▪ - 01:21, 19 October 2022 (UTC)

Cheers to that ! 🥂 Here is to many more years of translating, polishing, and new contributors.

Luno 🎃 03:17, 19 October 2022 (UTC)

So now that all the image requests are complete, I think we should make a deadline for requests so that we can make the full group photo and make the userbox soon. I was thinking maybe October 24th should be the deadline. As for the in game server celebration idea, I was thinking the 3 times could be 4 AM EST, 10 AM EST, and 6 PM EST, and the day we do this should be on a weekend. Thoughts?
Andrew360 14:42, 20 October 2022 (UTC)

┌────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘ Sounds nice, would have been nicer to do the end of the month or even the end of Scream Fortress, I feel like there are still a lot of people that are unaware of this little celebration, to me it feels a little like a family gathering rather than a simple number celebration, which is sweet in a way, hopefully mostly everyone was made aware so that they had a chance to hop on.

Luno 🎃 21:57, 20 October 2022 (UTC)

Looks like one more person has submitted a request, so I'll move the deadline to October 28th now in case more people add requests.
Andrew360 14:36, 24 October 2022 (UTC)

Thoughts on this group photo? Is there anything that should be changed/are there any other last requests? Andrew360 14:37, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

Some of the characters are bigger than the rest, probably will require resizing some of them (my Scout, for instance, looks the biggest out of the group), while the Pyro looks the smallest. I think some of the classes could be more close to each other like the 100k group image. The Demoman at the right is floating a little, too. I can try adjusting these things if you would like. - ▪ - 15:47, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

Same opinion here, some mercs looks small and/or are spaced apart. But otherwise amazing job on the group image. Decimate (talk) 18:29, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

Looks like me (the BLU pyro) and a few other people only have the upper body and shorter than other people. --Alex┋T 20:34, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

Alrighty then, I tried to make everyone a bit more closer together and I tried to scale some of the images. If this still isn't good enough, then maybe Woj or someone else could try to make the group photo.
Andrew360 20:08, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

After I'm done with the 3 upcoming paint variants I'm about to upload, I'll make my own version with a different filename (not a replacement). The 2nd version looks a lot better than the first, but I think a few things could be resized, which I'll be doing on my version. - ▪ - 14:09, 31 October 2022 (UTC)

Here's my version. I made everyone facing right on the right side, and everyone facing left on the left side. The Demoman wielding the Scottish Handshake was made on the middle since he is mostly facing center. Me, Andrew and Luno are around the middle to represent the image creators for the image:

500px

If this is the preferred version, feel free to rename the file to File:200k-groupphoto.png - ▪ - 13:12, 2 November 2022 (UTC)

┌────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘Sorry for extending the image border LOL.
GrampaSwood (talk) 13:17, 2 November 2022 (UTC)

All good bro. Gotta flex that Australium Amby. - ▪ - 13:22, 2 November 2022 (UTC)

Amazing work guys, you outdid yourselves ♥ Yossef • Talk 13:48, 2 November 2022 (UTC)

Thank. I find it a bit ironic that the 200k group photo has less people on it than the 100k one. But hey, what can ya' do? Some people come and go, it's still a nice ol' group picture. - ▪ - 14:21, 2 November 2022 (UTC)

It looks great! I also agree that I wish more people joined, but it's still good. Maybe at 300k if we still want to do another group photo we'll get more people, though it will probably be a while before 300k.
Andrew360 15:35, 2 November 2022 (UTC)

Well done all, looks great! Hope that we can get an even bigger celebration planned for 250k/300k. Epsilonal (talk) 23:43, 2 November 2022 (UTC)

It looks like everyone agrees with this version of the image, however AlexT told me that the grenades on his image should've been hidden, so I uploaded a new version of his image without grenades. So for the final group photo if you could change AlexT's image to the new version that would be appreciated. Then when the final group photo is uploaded we also need to make a userbox for it.
Andrew360 16:15, 7 November 2022 (UTC)

I updated the image with the latest revision of AlexT's loadout. - ▪ - 17:00, 7 November 2022 (UTC)

The Australium Frontier Justice goes across almost all of the Heavy to the right. Can you turn it to face the camera more? It doesn't look like any of the other characters have this problem, looks like it is just that one that is covering up other characters. Naleksuh (talk) 20:38, 9 November 2022 (UTC)

That looks fine to me. It's not covering anyone's face, so I don't see the problem, and the Heavy in question has the cosmetics being fully visible. The 100k picture had some instances of that, too. - ▪ - 21:31, 9 November 2022 (UTC)

I didn't see the 100K picture, but it won't be a big deal if people think it looks better this way. Naleksuh (talk) 22:42, 9 November 2022 (UTC)

I made the userbox. It's here: {{User 200k registered}}. It's a little larger in height than the 100k one, but I think it looks good. - ▪ - 15:06, 10 November 2022 (UTC)

Thank you everyone that participated; the picture and template are amazing. Good job <3 Yossef • Talk 18:54, 10 November 2022 (UTC)

┌────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘Thanks everyone! The group photos looks great! and Thanks Andrew360 for making my portrait 3 times :D. --Alex┋T

Community announcers with a large amount of response

So the {{Audio Nav}} states that community announcers should be on the map page rather than having their own page. However, Davy Jones has its own responses page. I suggest that for announcers with large amount of voice lines, such as the Crasher voice lines and the Bread Space voice lines, they should get their own page. This would reduce the amount of clutter on the page. I suggest it would have to be judged on a case-by-case basis. For example, the Crasher announcers have 100+ voice lines, but the Toastmaster only has 10.
GrampaSwood (talk) 21:46, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

 Agreed · Ashe (talk) 21:54, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

  I agree with that statement. However, for consistency sake, I think that perhaps making an additional “category” can be created for announcers with few voice lines, in the same Nav. This category can be called something around “Minor Announcers”.

Yossef • Talk 21:59, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

How about a "Community announcers" page instead of one page for every announcer with lots of lines? - BrazilianNut (talk) 22:28, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

Could also work, I'm in favour of either.
GrampaSwood (talk) 22:48, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

Wait, I misread your idea Swood. I would prefer @BrasilianNut 's idea, because of Halloween Boss voice responses · Ashe (talk) 23:26, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

  I like BrazilianNut's idea better. Furthermore, this will help us in the future when more possible announcers are added to the game. Yossef • Talk 09:40, 31 October 2022 (UTC)

I would agree with Gramps on his first post, there should be a subpage for announcers who only have basic lines for like KoTH and Control Point maps. But, all of the announcer voices are on either Payload maps or that one Player Destruction map Farmageddon. However Braziliannut's idea is probably the best way to go about doing this, the page is going to be absolutely massive as a result of mixing all of them in there at once though.ShadowMan44 (talk) 23:27, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

  In case you haven't done this yet. Honestly, I don't see the point. IMO, list of responses specific to a map should be on the map's page. Clutter could be controlled by collapsing the section. Just on opinion. A reason that Davey Jones should have been worked into tbe map's page is that his cue lines are integral to the map's mechanics, so, the list should be integral to the page. Astronaut will probably only ever have unintelligible responses on one map.

M I K A D O 282 🎃🎃🎃🎃🎃🎃 🎃🎃 🎃🎃 (Contact Mikado282 (SM)) | (contribs) (Help Wanted!) 02:00, 10 November 2022 (UTC)

  +1 for "Community announcers page" — Tark 01:42, 21 November 2022 (UTC)

Twinkle in TF2wiki?

I wonder if we can import some practical tools like Twinkle to maintain a page? It can also help us to combat vandalism.(And do a lot of stuffs...)---- BEUFK-Contributions-Talk 12:52, 23 November 2022 (UTC)

Looking through some of its functionality, it seems like it doesn't offer much useful functionality for users here. Mods/editors here are active enough to be able to catch vandalism quite quickly anyway and its other features seem to be just buttons to quickly add {{delete}} or open up a discussion for deletion (which is already very easy).
GrampaSwood (talk) 13:07, 23 November 2022 (UTC)

Excellent idea, but we don't have the Gadgets extension enabled :c — Tark 15:16, 23 November 2022 (UTC)

Any guide on how to create good User: page?

So I was wandering around the wiki and noticed how great some User: pages look and I just can't create a good one. Is there any guides for it? Yaroslav (talk) 15:55, 30 November 2022 (UTC)

You can check user pages of other users and use a bit of everything you like on your page, or if you know css you can create something more complex. Or shamelessly copy someone's else page :))). Denied (Talk) 18:19, 30 November 2022 (UTC)

Personally, it may require some CSS skills...---- BEUFK-Contributions-Talk 02:27, 1 December 2022 (UTC)

Slap some plain text up and claim you'll eventually make it better :) Jh34ghu43gu (talk) 04:22, 1 December 2022 (UTC)

You should learn some CSS, and Since this wiki is based on MediaWiki, you can use Templates, User boxes, etc. Just surf on some user pages and if you like it, take some code from it (if allowed to).

You need to make unique, something you would like to see all day! -- https://wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/Category:Templates -- And the User info Boxes Remember not editing anything that is not yours, Have fun in your journey.

⇨ maxwel (talk) 01:40, 22 January 2023 (UTC)

Russian wiki's cosmetic items "Update list" is done incorrectly?

Before I start, there is an example:

(English) The Glengarry Bonnet was added to the game. (Item name is listed. It's Glengarry Bonnet).

(Portuguese) A Boina de Glengarry foi adicionada ao jogo. (Item name is listed. It's Boina de Glengarry).

(Russian) Предмет был добавлен в игру. (Item name is not listed). It should be Гленгарри была добавлена в игру (Item name is listed. It's Гленгарри).

So almost every Russian cosmetic page lacks name of a cosmetic item in update list.

Should it be fixed or anything?

I changed some cosmetic pages. (It doesn't only focus on update list, so if you going to revert it back please only revert that). I think it would take a week to "fix" it for every cosmetics listed on Cosmetics page.

Here is more examples:

(English) Added a community-contributed description for the Texas Ten Gallon. (Item name is listed. It's Texas Ten Gallon).

(Portuguese) Adicionada uma descrição contribuída pela comunidade aos Dez-Galões do Texas. (Item name is listed. It's Dez-Galões do Texas).

(Russian) Добавлено описание от сообщества. (Item name is not listed). It should be Добавлено описание от сообщества для Большой техасской шляпы (Item name is listed. It's Большая техасская шляпа).

(English) The Whoopee Cap can now be uncrated with Unusual quality. (Item name is listed. It's Whoopee Cap).

(Español) La Corona de Yupi ahora puede ser obtenida en aspecto Inusual. (Item name is listed. It's Corona de Yupi).

(Russian) Теперь может быть необычного типа. (Item name is not listed). It should be Молодежная корона теперь может быть необычного типа. (Item name is listed. It's Молодежная корона).

Yaroslav (talk) 19:58, 3 December 2022 (UTC)

I wouldn't say they are incorrect; I would say they use a different format. I have seen articles that use "This item was added to the game" instead of "[Item] was/were added to the game" and articles that use "Updated the description" instead of "Updated the description for [Item]."

While the update history is mostly 1:1 with the official patch notes, there are instances of differences between them, such as new items being part of a case ("[Item] was added to the game" in the update history versus "Added the [Case] / Contains [#] new community-created cosmetic items" in the patch notes) or a note that mentions different items ("Updated models/materials for [Item]" in the update history versus "Updated models/materials for [Item] and [Other Item]" in the patch notes).

I would say that, as long as the wording is left as close to the original as possible, it's fine. What should not be done is, for example, having the update history read "Changed the description" when the patch note reads "Updated the description." - BrazilianNut (talk) 22:03, 3 December 2022 (UTC)

Patch notes references

Should we use == References ==, or === References ===? Tiagoquix (talk) 01:32, 8 December 2022 (UTC)

I think == References == is the correct one but there are some patch pages with === References ===. Mgpt (talk) 13:42, 8 December 2022 (UTC)

Yeah, probably == References == is the one we should use. We could add a global filter, I think. Tiagoquix (talk) 14:35, 8 December 2022 (UTC)

  There is an inconsistency in the patch notes in this regard. In my opinion, I prefer keeping it the same as the other articles, that means using this == References ==. Yossef • Talk 15:01, 8 December 2022 (UTC)

  +1 for == References ==. - BrazilianNut (talk) 15:12, 8 December 2022 (UTC)

 Agree On a personal note, the "References" is certainly as important as the other parts of an article.------BEUFK-Contributions-Talk 12:28, 10 December 2022 (UTC)

== References == should be used.
GrampaSwood (talk) 00:21, 31 January 2023 (UTC)

User subpages (drafts/templates/unrelated content,etc...)

Hello, there were several user files deleted in the last months, mostly unused for more than 5 to 10 years. There are also some user subpages that contain all kinds of templates, some being an old copy from the mainspace, something not even related, own content, or simply abandoned/unused for years (also in main categories, like Category:Templates that use translation switching). I think there should be a Policy subpage with this information (see sections below) on the Wiki. Some examples here Mgpt (talk) 17:26, 30 January 2023 (UTC)

I dont want to make enemies here or something, but this userpage... Mgpt (talk) 20:28, 30 January 2023 (UTC)

I don't see much wrong with this if I'm honest. If it's not in mainspace category, there's nothing wrong with it.
GrampaSwood (talk) 20:35, 30 January 2023 (UTC)

There should be at least a section like Wikipedia has... Unused files get deleted for being unused, the same should apply at least (in my opinion) to old user page templates (like the ones I provided, which are just copies of mainspace or similar) and these cases where the user is using the Wiki to "host" their images and content. Of course this is just my opinion and as I said there should be official notes regarding this. Mgpt (talk) 21:32, 30 January 2023 (UTC)

A section like this can be created, however, considering that users are essentially allowed to do anything on their user space (such as Mikado hosting images of things he finds relevant to TF2 in real life, or me having a list of Strange weapons I don't own yet) as long as it's not something such as spam, I'm not sure it will be a very big section.
GrampaSwood (talk) 21:38, 30 January 2023 (UTC)

Maybe a "See also" link to the Wikipedia article below User content. Mgpt (talk) 16:30, 8 March 2023 (UTC)

"Styles" should come before "Painted variants" in articles about cosmetics

I don't think it makes sense to show the painted variants with the different styles of the item first and then show the actual unpainted styles in a later section.
For example: Nine-Pipe_Problem#Painted_variants and Nine-Pipe_Problem#Styles. Tiagoquix (talk) 13:31, 3 February 2023 (UTC)

Its fine in my opinion, doesnt need to be changed . Mgpt (talk) 16:01, 8 March 2023 (UTC)

Old and no longer used account deletion request

Hello. There is this old account of mine that I do not use anymore. Could the TF Wiki staff delete it, please?
The account: User:Perk | User talk:Perk
The Wiki does not state it is not registered, therefore, it is.
Thanks in advance. Tiagoquix (talk) 09:37, 7 March 2023 (UTC)

Here, though it doesn't seem to be possible to delete it entirely. Mgpt (talk) 16:27, 8 March 2023 (UTC)

Thanks! Tiagoquix (talk) 16:52, 9 March 2023 (UTC)

It's also required for you to prove the account is yours before it's deleted through e-mail.
GrampaSwood (talk) 17:04, 9 March 2023 (UTC)

Unfortunately, I cannot prove it. That account does not have any e-mail linked to it (I know it doesn't because the "forgot password" page tells if a specific username has an e-mail linked to it or not). The only proof I can provide is that I used to have similar usernames to "Perk" before "Tiagoquix": User:Perkzitos and User:P3rkzitos. Tiagoquix (talk) 03:06, 10 March 2023 (UTC)

Since the account has no edits, a generic username, and you cannot prove ownership, we unfortunately cannot process this request. We apologize for the inconvenience. — Tark 17:14, 10 March 2023 (UTC)

No problem! I appreciate your willingness. Tiagoquix (talk) 20:04, 10 March 2023 (UTC)

Item infoboxes

Hello, with help from Tark, I pushed the changes from the sandbox page. (Last edit: {{Item infobox}}). I already started by creating the category for Crafting items which should be completed, and the idea is to use {{Item infobox/item name}} (or one of these formats), preventing outdated info and template "creation" in every language page (see example here). Cosmetic items and weapons support is not fully tested yet so please don't create the pages for them. What do you think of this? Thanks. Mgpt (talk) 16:19, 8 March 2023 (UTC)

You may notice the use of <includeonly> which is because of red links (backpack image/styles/name), they can be avoided with "custom-icon" and "name" but I'm not sure if its ideal. Mgpt (talk) 16:41, 8 March 2023 (UTC)

I don't oppose to the idea of adding new strings or functions, before I give my proper input, I'd like to see it tested. Yossef • Talk 19:31, 8 March 2023 (UTC)

Seems to be working fine for all types, there could be a string missing or two for weapons but they can be placed on dictionary/common strings. Mgpt (talk) 19:51, 9 March 2023 (UTC)

This idea looks good on paper but doesn't really solve any issues as we can already sync infoboxes (WindBOT does that).

Unfortunately, it is quite unrealistic to create and maintain over 2000 new pages just for a small detail like this. And even if the infobox is updated, the rest of the article may not be.

For something like this to be viable, you would have to address the following issues: 1) How can we make the transition? We can't simply edit all item articles. 2) How do you handle items with prefixes, suffixes, and descriptions that are not present in English? 3) How do you handle certain infobox parameters that require text in other languages? 4) Why is this template needed? — Tark 17:24, 10 March 2023 (UTC)

As I said earlier on the IRC, this can be done in a progressive way, first the infoboxes are created and then they can be implemented whenever needed or someone updates the page. A good example is the Crafting items category I already completed (these items have basic information compared to weapons or cosmetics), the only thing left to decide is the format of the page. For the prefixes, suffixes and descriptions we can use the lang template like I did on my last edits, and for the rest of the text we can create a section on dictionary/common strings, or simply don't create the infobox, this is also why the weapon infoboxes would be the last, if I'm not wrong its where those texts (like the reload type for weapons) would appear more frequently or at all. This template would be useful because of the backpack links and availability section, and really everything on the infobox, so I see a lot of benefits. Let me know if I missed something Mgpt (talk) 18:24, 10 March 2023 (UTC)

Heya! Apologies, I haven't been around much.

In the long run, it won't make sense for certain pages to have these new infoboxes while others do not. Your suggestions for handling prefixes, suffixes, and non-English descriptions don't make much sense. It's not common for editors to check every lang file, so having individual pages for the infobox that work exactly like they do now will not be helpful (someone still needs to update the page manually).

Also, please don't make any further changes to existing pages. I won't go against the majority, but people need to discuss it first. This is a major change and can't be done by one user alone. — Tark 17:04, 17 March 2023 (UTC)

I think its ready for every type by now. So this is my last comment about the infoboxes, if someone has a better implementation for the used-by parameter, comment on my talk page, Thanks. Mgpt (talk) 20:47, 17 March 2023 (UTC)

Taunt kill image inconsistency

On each class page there is a section for taunt kills which shows images of what taunt kills a class can do. However, on the Taunts page there are also taunt kills, however, these display different images from the class page ones. For example, on Demoman#Taunt_Attack you see File:Demoeyelander.png, but on Taunts#Kill_taunts you see File:Demomaneyelandertauntkill.png. There are other examples of this if you compare class pages to the taunts page. So my question is
A: Should one of these images be removed so there's the same image for both the taunt and class pages, and if the answer is yes for A:
B: Which images should be deleted, the ones on the taunts page or the ones on the class pages?
I personally think one of these images should be removed with the images on the taunts page being deleted.
Andrew360 15:12, 12 March 2023 (UTC)

Last laugh MvM

new cosmetics added due to a charity Aistrrr (talk) 16:59, 31 March 2023 (UTC)

Could you elaborate a bit further?
GrampaSwood (talk) 17:02, 31 March 2023 (UTC)

Elaborated. — 07:12, 1 April 2023 (UTC)

Undocumented changes inconstancy

I just noticed how random it is.
Should it be === Undocumented changes === or == Undocumented changes == ?

Yaroslav (talk) 18:24, 31 March 2023 (UTC)

== Undocumented changes ==.
GrampaSwood (talk) 18:27, 31 March 2023 (UTC)

Isnt === Undocumented changes === the correct one, like most of the previous patches? Also for cases like the March 1, 2023 Patch. Mgpt (talk) 19:01, 31 March 2023 (UTC)

I assumed it to be a similar case to the References discussion previously, as we agreed on ==. If === is more common we should use that.
GrampaSwood (talk) 19:03, 31 March 2023 (UTC)

Should we archive the 2023 April Fool Discussion?

Maybe some of ideas which was not used in this April Fool Event can be approved by doing some changes. It would also inspire other editors in the future. --BEUFK - Contributions-Talk 04:53, 3 April 2023 (UTC)

Stats in update history & patch notes consistencies

This is about 2 issues:

1. The consistency of patch notes.

2. Should the stats be listed in the update history?

I believe that it's too much effort to list every single original stat in the update history, and it is also not the purpose of the update history to describe the state every weapon has been in (merely to indicate which updates have changed the weapon).

I also think that the patch notes should essentially be a 1:1 copy of the wording used in the original patch notes, with some minor exceptions i.e. "added x amount of unusual effects" -> "Added [unu effect name] to the game" instead. This has been an unwritten rule for quite a while now, but has been randomly overturned a while ago without any discussion whatsoever, so here's the formal discussion.
GrampaSwood (talk) 10:20, 10 April 2023 (UTC)

My thoughts are the same as yours: it's too much effort, that's not the Update history's purpose, and patch notes should be as 1:1 as possible. - BrazilianNut (talk) 11:02, 10 April 2023 (UTC)

For me, the Update History should tell what happened to the items thorough the time span of the game, including stats changes and such to the finest details. Imagine a history book that didn't tell what happen exactly in the past. Yes, it's required a lot of effort, but it's what Update history is.

P.S. History is a chronological record of events, as of the life or development of a people or institution, often including an explanation of or commentary on those events. Rikka Takanashi (talk) • (contributions) 13:38, 10 April 2023 (UTC)